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<blockquote data-quote="Dausuul" data-source="post: 8844170" data-attributes="member: 58197">On the subject of the cleric:<ul>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">Channel Divinity is now prof times per long rest instead of once per short rest. If they're going to keep short rests at one hour (and maybe even if not), I approve of this change.</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">I like the &quot;Holy Order&quot; mechanic--basically, the decision to be a &quot;weapons cleric&quot; or a &quot;magic cleric&quot; is no longer dependent on domains, it's a separate choice made at 2nd level. However, the scholar option feels incredibly underwhelming compared to the other two. Even allowing for the fact that it's much easier to get heavy armor training now, I can't imagine picking a few knowledge skill bonuses over a) heavy armor or b) rapid Channel Divinity recharge.</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">As expected, domain is now chosen at 3rd level. This is a bit of a flavor/mechanic mismatch, but there's nothing stopping you from declaring yourself a cleric of Pelor (or whoever) at level 1, it just has no mechanical impact until 3rd.</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">Smite Undead is a core feature. Dunno about that. There's no real justification for Turn Undead being a core cleric feature except D&amp;D tradition, do we need to double down on it?</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">The &quot;weapons cleric&quot; and &quot;magic cleric&quot; 8th-level domain features (bonus damage on weapon strikes or bonus damage on cantrips) have now been merged into a single ability at 7th level, which gives you both. Sensible and straightforward.</li>
<li data-xf-list-type="ul">The sample Life Domain looks pretty much the same as the one we already had: All healing, all the time. In fact, I think the features are literally the same, except for the &quot;weapons cleric&quot; benefits (heavy armor proficiency, bonus weapon damage) which have been moved to the core class. I do question whether they really need another healing option for Channel Divinity when the core class already gives you one. Granted, the Life Domain one is better, but surely they could come up with something a bit more interesting?</li>
</ul>Overall, no dramatic changes but a lot of modest upgrades. I'm still not a fan of the Arcane/Divine/Primal spell lists, but at least the cleric doesn't make you check spell schools; you just get all divine spells, full stop.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Dausuul, post: 8844170, member: 58197"] On the subject of the cleric: [LIST] [*]Channel Divinity is now prof times per long rest instead of once per short rest. If they're going to keep short rests at one hour (and maybe even if not), I approve of this change. [*]I like the "Holy Order" mechanic--basically, the decision to be a "weapons cleric" or a "magic cleric" is no longer dependent on domains, it's a separate choice made at 2nd level. However, the scholar option feels incredibly underwhelming compared to the other two. Even allowing for the fact that it's much easier to get heavy armor training now, I can't imagine picking a few knowledge skill bonuses over a) heavy armor or b) rapid Channel Divinity recharge. [*]As expected, domain is now chosen at 3rd level. This is a bit of a flavor/mechanic mismatch, but there's nothing stopping you from declaring yourself a cleric of Pelor (or whoever) at level 1, it just has no mechanical impact until 3rd. [*]Smite Undead is a core feature. Dunno about that. There's no real justification for Turn Undead being a core cleric feature except D&D tradition, do we need to double down on it? [*]The "weapons cleric" and "magic cleric" 8th-level domain features (bonus damage on weapon strikes or bonus damage on cantrips) have now been merged into a single ability at 7th level, which gives you both. Sensible and straightforward. [*]The sample Life Domain looks pretty much the same as the one we already had: All healing, all the time. In fact, I think the features are [I]literally [/I]the same, except for the "weapons cleric" benefits (heavy armor proficiency, bonus weapon damage) which have been moved to the core class. I do question whether they really need another healing option for Channel Divinity when the core class already gives you one. Granted, the Life Domain one is better, but surely they could come up with something a bit more interesting? [/LIST] Overall, no dramatic changes but a lot of modest upgrades. I'm still not a fan of the Arcane/Divine/Primal spell lists, but at least the cleric doesn't make you check spell schools; you just get all divine spells, full stop. [/QUOTE]

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