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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mustrum_Ridcully" data-source="post: 3835781" data-attributes="member: 710">Yeah, I would also prefer if the undead turning wouldn't be aimed at destroying them. They should just keep them at bay (I think one of the often overlooked properties of the Vampire - there is some text indicating that you can use a holy symbol to keep them from approaching you, but I have rarely seen that in play, if ever.)The current mechanics are awful in several ways: 1) The whole Turning Check / Turning System is a subsystem that integrates badly with the rest of the system2) Basing it on HD breaks down since most undeads have twice as much HD has CR - except those that are actually supposed to be non-mooks, like Vampires, Lichs and several of the Incorporeal ones. 3) Turned undeads are annoying, because they run away and force the party to follow them, needlessly increasing the time needed to dispatch them.An alternative mechanic: 1) Cleric makes a turning check (maybe it's a skill, class skill, divine caster level, level or a similar check) against Undeads Will Defense (modified by TUrn Resistance). (In D&D 3, replace this with a Will Save modified by Turning Defense against something like 10 + Turning Level / 2 + Charisma Modifier)2) Success means the undead can't approach the Cleric, and is even forced back from threatening range. Ranged attacks and spell attacks should probably come at a penalty. (shaken effect in 3rd edition?)3) Failure means the undead can approach (but might take a limited amount of damage). (Maybe 2d6 points of positive energy damage) No further penalties.4) The effect lasts only as long as the Cleric spends an action "turning" the undead.5) The range and area should probably be limited (Range 60 ft, Cone?), allowing the undead to outmaneuver the Cleric (but maybe the Cleric can spend an immediate/free action to react to movement, so if he encounters multiple undead, some will eventually manage to get behind them. It is usuable at will. Maybe it should even be an ability that everybody can use, but the Clerics better (half level bonus for Non-Clerics, +level bonus for Clerics on turning checks, Cleric can "add" positive energy for extra damage)</blockquote>

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