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Message: <blockquote data-quote="HeinorNY" data-source="post: 3962220" data-attributes="member: 16178">But we really don't need pros and cons to have a good and construcitve discussion. If we had only neutral people, or people that has not yet decided to go to 4E or not, we could have a good discussion.I'm saying "pros" and "cons" considering the 4E as a whole. If we will discuss Elven Accuracy, we need people to give pro arguments and people that give con arguments. Nothing new here.The problems start when some people, that already made up their minds, start behaving unconstructively because of that decision. They decide to not go to 4E, and then enter in an anti-4E crusade, trying to show the worst in every new preview, looking for problems in details, hyperboles or corner cases, but mostly using the same old points, and complementing Cadfan, they get really old, really annoying, really fast.OR they decide to go to 4E and try to prove everyone that the designer's choice was the best and most correct one, even when the designer himself is not yet sure of that. The "dragon tail cut" was a very fun episode. Some people really wasted a lot of effort to somehow prove that name was ok, and then the designers just came and said, nah this is not a nice name.I think a good way to handle it, (or How to Survive Enworld 4E Forums), is to not get it personal. If I say something about D&D, good or bad, I'm not saying it about your game, I'm saying it about WotC's game.</blockquote>