[OT] Light from a distant sun


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Just read the article. You know, it's a damn shame life didn't evolve on Jupiter. It'd have a much better chance for galactic conquest without all that pesky terraforming!
 

Good point, Piratecat. Isaac Asimov once wrote a science fiction story about Earth discovering life on Jupiter that was very funny. (Piratecat, if you want me to spoil the joke, let me know.)

Actually, the gas giants tend to gather up some of the debris in a solar system and may make it easier for life on earth sized planets.

For some of the planets spotted beyond our Solar System, a few are gas giants large enough to easily have moons the size of Earth. Imagine an Earth that circled around a planet larger than Jupiter, which in turn orbited its sun. Can you imagine what the sky would look like.

Astronomy is an old interest of mine. Ironically, it is helping me in critiquing a friend's screenplay.
 

Life...

My interest will be more piqued when science eventually figures out that the requirements for life are much less strict than they think. :) It's starting, but not quite complete. If the moon can support some bacteria, certainly many other places can as well. Maybe a minority, but a signifigant one....


....and then, speculation begins about what life would have been like....

....of course, there's all this terraforming and genetic alterations....


...gives me a picture of a future where homo sapiens alters itself based on what planet it lives on. Superhumans living comfortably on Mercury due to special genetic tweaks that make the temperature no more than warm to them....


But that's mindless speculation. Astrology interests me, but mostly from a biological standpoint. I'd like to see what other varied forms of life are out there. I like the pyrotechnics of astronomy. I could care less about the math and chemistry of it. :)
 

I'm sorry to be a prig about this, but "astrology" and "astronomy" are not interchangeable. They aren't really related, and haven't been for centuries.

Robert Forward wrote a book called Saturn Rukh about an ecosystem on Saturn. It's not that great a book, except for the science part of it. Forward is a world-class scientist, and it shows. He isn't really a world-class novelist, though.

Anyway, I have a life-long interest in this stuff. From all the observations and theories made over the last 20 - 30 years, I'd be surprised if there aren't trillions of Earth-like planets out there.

If you're interested in why scientists generally think Earth-like conditions (which the average person with only a passing interest in the subject might not consider terribly Earth-like) are necessary for life to evolve, check out Clifford Pickover's book, called, IIRC, The Science of Aliens. Great stuff.
 

Good stuff, WRon. I've read a lot of similar info, and most of it regarding Jupiter's role more recently, but that is a good summation.

IMO, the only definite survival of the human race lies in our ability to occupy more than one target of miscellaneous space bombardment prior to anihilation of life on this one. Identifying, reaching and colonizing another rock(s) is a requirement, a race against time. Go team! :)

I'd like to give a shout out to our pal Jupiter who's been taking the hits for us lo these many years! :D
 

Mark,

Jupiter took the comet Schumaker-Levy a few years back. If we had taken the hit, no one would be here.

I would like to see colonies in space in my lifetime. There is room in the solar system.

However, give me some form of FTL travel, or even very good slower than light travel then Alpha Centauri A & B and Tau Ceti here we come! I would be organizing an expedition immediately.

Congratulations on your first publication at Creative Mountain Games. Sorry I did not make it up to Games Plus this weekend, but I kind of suspected I would be busy.

(Got walk the dog. Then get back to the boards to save Oerth. Up, up and away!!:D )
 

Great article, thanks for the link WR! Astronomy is one of my many interest areas so when I have spare time it's fun to read up on it. If that type of stuff piques your interest talk to Fayredeth about "sparticles" interesting crap!
 

Before I married my wife, I made her promise that as soon there is a colony on the moon, we'd move there. I intend to hold her to it, too.

Some interesting points to consider. There may be many, many Earth-like planets out there. Many of those may even house life. But what are the odds for advanced civilazation? One important thing to consider is that, as far as we know, Earth's moon is far larger than what should be normal for a planet our size. This gives us a tidal effect that may have had a great influence on evolution. Also, Earth was rocked by an enormous impact early on (which was the impact that most probably created the moon), the result of which is tectonic activity, continental plates and so forth. This brought heavier minerals, particularly iron, to the surface that wouldn't be present there otherwise. Then there is the Oort Cloud to consider. It is now thought that some part, if not a major part, of the water on Earth may have come from tiny comets and cometary debris falling to Earth over time. It is uncertain whether a comet field like the Oort Cloud would be common around other stars. Also, the size of the planet matters a great deal. A smaller planet will cool faster. Once it's core has cooled to solid, much of the deeper rocks become porous to water and the surface water can get locked away deep below the surface (one hypothesis of what happened to Mars). I'm not sure if there is a downside to a larger planet that cools slower.

Oh, and the reason that we look for life similar to ours is that we know what to look for. We cannot look for lifeforms that completely different because we would have no guidelines on what to look for.
 

There's a great deal of information about extrasolar planets floating around the web. Some of the best stuff can be found either at NASA's website or linked from there.

It's certainly true that extrasolar planets are very common -- this is a big paradigm-shift from just 7 years ago, when a small group of astronomers observed a distant star and saw a "wobble" with a truly bizarre period: 365.25 days! Turns out they got their math wrong (they measured the period of Earth's revolution!), but shortly after that, astronomers did start finding real instances, though the smallest to date has been about 4 times the mass of Jupiter or so.

Clearly, this implies that planetary systems are more commonplace than previously believed, although no real guess as to the proportion of gas giants to terrestrial planets can be made.

The article had a bit of sensationalism attached to it that I wish hadn't been. Though Jupiter has definitely been a helpful factor in protecting Earth from past impacts, it certainly isn't the great protector that the article implies. For completeness, Earth's moon should be considered for its ability to protect, as well, even if to a lesser degree.

As is common with these kinds of articles, the journalist knows just enough about the facts to get things wrong. Comet Shoemaker-Levy should be Shoemaker-Levy 9 (this may sound like I'm picking nits, but the Shoemakers and David Levy have codiscovered a sizeable number of comets), and the implication in the article is that Jupiter saved us from certain doom at the "hands" of that comet, even though, in fact, the comet would never have crossed Earth's orbit.

While I expect that someday we will discover extrasolar terrestrial planets, I would be loathe to make anything more than a hopeful statement. I certainly wouldn't indicate that there are probably as many Earth-like planets as Jupiter-like planets: 80 data points does not a small error-bar make!

I also am wary of the journal "Astrobiology." Coming from the scientific field, and knowing that most important abstracts are published either at conferences or to the journal "Nature," I am inherently skeptical. Of course, again, I'm hearing the scientists' words through a poor interpreter, and won't condemn someone for something they might not have said.

Bottom line: I think we'll discover a plethora of planets, both Earth-like and Jupiter-like. As technology improves, I think we'll se subtler and subtler motions of stars. I also think we'll decipher more complex motions (with our current technology, if we were on a planet orbiting a star 40 Light-Years away, we would have trouble even detecting Jupiter, let alone the other 8 planets) as tech improves. Eventually, we'll discover terrestrial planets, and then use knowledge from other areas of astronomy to determine the presence of methane in the atmospheres (surely aliens fart, right?!) of these planets, and hence, life.

Someday, we might even discover life elsewhere. I'm holding out for Europa to house life, though I'll only believe it when it's confirmed.

I certainly love the press that astronomy gets from time to time. I just wish I wouldn't have to spend all my time in planetarium shows (my career is working in a planetarium) correcting good-intentioned-but-wrong statements by overeager journalists ;)
 

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