Acid_crash
First Post
Olaf the Stout said:
I really like some of these ideas, I shall have to think not so long and hard and take some of them. Thanks.
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Other ways of handling XP
- Thread starter Acid_crash
- Start date
I really like some of these ideas, I shall have to think not so long and hard and take some of them. Thanks.
shilsen
Adventurer
I award a fixed amount of XP per session to keep the PCs leveling at the pace I want them to. Usually it's 1000 XP per session, with a couple of sessions haing 2000-3000 XP to get them to next level at an expedient point. PCs get the XP whether the player was present for the game or not.
Thotas
First Post
Yeah, when I looked at True20, the "you level when the GM says so" approach floored me. Mainly 'cause half of my brain yelled "Blasphemy!" and the other half yelled "That's brilliant!" -- saves a lot of figuring when trying to run a Adventure Path, for sure.
But there is still one thing I gotta say about the xp point -- I love that bit from the L5R rules (and someone's post above) that let the group's players award an xp bonus to a player for making a positive contribution to the game. There are definate ways that the practice would help to deal with certain types of disruptive players, munchkins in particular.
But there is still one thing I gotta say about the xp point -- I love that bit from the L5R rules (and someone's post above) that let the group's players award an xp bonus to a player for making a positive contribution to the game. There are definate ways that the practice would help to deal with certain types of disruptive players, munchkins in particular.
blargney the second
blargney the minute's son
There's some awesome stuff in this thread! The timing is very convenient, since I'm just starting a new campaign and I have to figure out what to do for XP. 
*sets up camp*
-blarg
*sets up camp*
-blarg
Crothian
First Post
I do that gain when the DM feels they should, but I fake it by giving out XP every week based on what happened. It isn't based on CR's and fights but how the group did. That way they still get XP based on what they do, have the numbers for crafting items and other things that take XP, and they gain levels at the pace I want.
Dracorat
First Post
I am also running a group through WLD and another group through RttToEE
For WLD, I award that group half of the value of the encounter, calculated otherwise normally as per the DMG exp chart.
For traps, I award as though it were a monster encounter (on the WLD group, halved like I previously stated) unless they 'disable' it by tripping it (intentional or not) in which case I might award if I feel generous - at half normal value (which means quarter value for the WLD group).
If an extreme combat comes up and they run from it I will award half exp. - example: My WLD group opened a stone door. (They went through quite the rigamarole to open it too) and behind was a Huge Black Pudding (it was advanced). They slammed the door shut and ran. Had they decided to fight it, it would have been gauranteed death on their part.
I awarded half the usual exp for being intelligent about not fighting that.
As for action points, we use them too but for different purpose.
You don't get APs as you level up. Instead, when you complete an encounter, everyone gets one. This is cumulative (you can save them up).
However, once the party rests (or dies and ressurrects through death insurance) then all Action Points are wiped clean.
I use this system to encourage people to not do the "we fight, we rest, we fight, we rest..." system and still not have to incorporate some silly mechanic for making them not do it (like every time they take an adventure, the world will explode in seven days if they don't complete it in that time). (Although every once in a while, I do =P )
For WLD, I award that group half of the value of the encounter, calculated otherwise normally as per the DMG exp chart.
For traps, I award as though it were a monster encounter (on the WLD group, halved like I previously stated) unless they 'disable' it by tripping it (intentional or not) in which case I might award if I feel generous - at half normal value (which means quarter value for the WLD group).
If an extreme combat comes up and they run from it I will award half exp. - example: My WLD group opened a stone door. (They went through quite the rigamarole to open it too) and behind was a Huge Black Pudding (it was advanced). They slammed the door shut and ran. Had they decided to fight it, it would have been gauranteed death on their part.
I awarded half the usual exp for being intelligent about not fighting that.
As for action points, we use them too but for different purpose.
You don't get APs as you level up. Instead, when you complete an encounter, everyone gets one. This is cumulative (you can save them up).
However, once the party rests (or dies and ressurrects through death insurance) then all Action Points are wiped clean.
I use this system to encourage people to not do the "we fight, we rest, we fight, we rest..." system and still not have to incorporate some silly mechanic for making them not do it (like every time they take an adventure, the world will explode in seven days if they don't complete it in that time). (Although every once in a while, I do =P )
SteveC
Doing the best imitation of myself
Since the 3.0 rules came out, I've run half a dozen campaigns od D&D, each one of which has had a new tweak on XP. The players didn't like any of 'em.
What I'm doing now is pretty simple, and has been universally received as positive, which is:
The group maintains a common XP total. All characters have the same XP, and when a character dies and is replaced, the new one comes in with the same XP total as the last. Replace a character? It comes in with the group total.
Each "encounter" in the game, which can be roleplaying, combat, a puzzle or whatever, gives an XP award of one XP block. An XP block = 80 XP x current level. That means that for every 13 encounters the group has, it gains a level. Especially difficult encounters can rate more than one block.
Dying and being raised gives a character a negative level, which is restored the next time they gain a character level.
Characters may spend action points to create a pool of XP for magic item creation. Spending an action point gives you 50 XP per level at the time you spent the point. These points stay around until you use them.
Since all of the characters receive the same XP for each session (even if they aren't there), I give a bonus in Action Points for all the things that I would normally grant bonus XP for: journals, good roleplaying, exceptional plans or ideas...and so forth.
So far so good...no complaints yet!
--Steve
What I'm doing now is pretty simple, and has been universally received as positive, which is:
The group maintains a common XP total. All characters have the same XP, and when a character dies and is replaced, the new one comes in with the same XP total as the last. Replace a character? It comes in with the group total.
Each "encounter" in the game, which can be roleplaying, combat, a puzzle or whatever, gives an XP award of one XP block. An XP block = 80 XP x current level. That means that for every 13 encounters the group has, it gains a level. Especially difficult encounters can rate more than one block.
Dying and being raised gives a character a negative level, which is restored the next time they gain a character level.
Characters may spend action points to create a pool of XP for magic item creation. Spending an action point gives you 50 XP per level at the time you spent the point. These points stay around until you use them.
Since all of the characters receive the same XP for each session (even if they aren't there), I give a bonus in Action Points for all the things that I would normally grant bonus XP for: journals, good roleplaying, exceptional plans or ideas...and so forth.
So far so good...no complaints yet!
--Steve
Voadam
Legend
For my wildwood pbp game I do the level when the DM says you do style as well, whole group levels. Mostly based on getting through the module so after defeating the BBEG or a good mid point. If raise dead/reincarnate comes up I'm planning on doing the negative level for a level instead of losing a full level. XP spells cost extra gold and item crafting costs just gp.
One method I've used is a mathematical variant of the "you level every so often" system.
P = party level (average of the PCs level)
G = # of sessions per level (rate of advanvement control)
X = 1000 * P / G
X will be the XP per PC to give out. For levels 1-20, if G=2 it amounts to saying you will level up every 2 games. From a PC viewpoint, they don't have to know that. They just get the XP and do their own work from there.
One valuable use for this forumula is for comparing XP rates. By looking at how much XP gets you a level and at what rate, and comparing to other systems, you get a sense mathematically of how they compare. We're not talking rocket science here, but some GM's don't even think about how many fast of a progression they rate, or how to control it in a fashion that's desirable for the players.
Consider: If all your games last 8 hours, how much XP should you give if you play every day? Every week? Every 2 weeks? Once a Month?
Some DM's might answer "the same amount". Most players would argue, the less frequent, the more XP. Players want a sense of advancement over REAL TIME. So how often you play affects that (and in turn, if you play every day, it might be wise to slow things down, or you may be 20th level in a month).
It gets further complicated, based on how long your sessions are. Long sessions generally ought to give more XP, but how much?
I might argue that playing 6 hour sessions once a month should level the PCs each session. I might also argue that I like to level every other sesssion. Sometimes that's contradictory. If we assume that's reasonable game length, we could use that as a baseline (hours played), and use frequency as a control to set the leveling pace. A new formula might spring up:
P = Party Level (average PC level)
L = Session length (approximate hours played)
O = Optimal Session Length (6 hours, change it in your math if you like)
F = Session Frequency (# times per month)
X = (1000 * P) * (L/O) / F
The 1000 * P equals the XP needed to level up. Everything else is a matter of reducing that. Playing a 6 hour game gets you all of the XP to level up, if you play once a month.
The math looks right. It should level you up once a month, no matter how often you play.
Both formulas I present do not take into consideration anything that happens in the game. They are strictly about setting a pace of leveling. If nothing else, they are mathematical expressions of the "PC's level when I feel like it" philosophy, by giving numbers that support the desired rate of the GM.
You could also use the 1000 * P piece to come up with new XP rewards. Let's say completing a major story goal is worth 20% of a level. When now you know how much XP that is (X = 1000 * P * 20%).
An alternative for story awards is to consider that the story IS the CR of the party level (since it was written for their level). Then just award XP for completing it as they faced a rather long encounter (that wrapped around all the encounters that made up the story). The XP for CR generally follows the formula of 300XP per CR (300 * CR). So defeating the BBEG and saving the princess is worth an extra 300 * P, in addition to the XP the party got for defeating the BBEG directly.
Math is hard.
P = party level (average of the PCs level)
G = # of sessions per level (rate of advanvement control)
X = 1000 * P / G
X will be the XP per PC to give out. For levels 1-20, if G=2 it amounts to saying you will level up every 2 games. From a PC viewpoint, they don't have to know that. They just get the XP and do their own work from there.
One valuable use for this forumula is for comparing XP rates. By looking at how much XP gets you a level and at what rate, and comparing to other systems, you get a sense mathematically of how they compare. We're not talking rocket science here, but some GM's don't even think about how many fast of a progression they rate, or how to control it in a fashion that's desirable for the players.
Consider: If all your games last 8 hours, how much XP should you give if you play every day? Every week? Every 2 weeks? Once a Month?
Some DM's might answer "the same amount". Most players would argue, the less frequent, the more XP. Players want a sense of advancement over REAL TIME. So how often you play affects that (and in turn, if you play every day, it might be wise to slow things down, or you may be 20th level in a month).
It gets further complicated, based on how long your sessions are. Long sessions generally ought to give more XP, but how much?
I might argue that playing 6 hour sessions once a month should level the PCs each session. I might also argue that I like to level every other sesssion. Sometimes that's contradictory. If we assume that's reasonable game length, we could use that as a baseline (hours played), and use frequency as a control to set the leveling pace. A new formula might spring up:
P = Party Level (average PC level)
L = Session length (approximate hours played)
O = Optimal Session Length (6 hours, change it in your math if you like)
F = Session Frequency (# times per month)
X = (1000 * P) * (L/O) / F
The 1000 * P equals the XP needed to level up. Everything else is a matter of reducing that. Playing a 6 hour game gets you all of the XP to level up, if you play once a month.
The math looks right. It should level you up once a month, no matter how often you play.
Both formulas I present do not take into consideration anything that happens in the game. They are strictly about setting a pace of leveling. If nothing else, they are mathematical expressions of the "PC's level when I feel like it" philosophy, by giving numbers that support the desired rate of the GM.
You could also use the 1000 * P piece to come up with new XP rewards. Let's say completing a major story goal is worth 20% of a level. When now you know how much XP that is (X = 1000 * P * 20%).
An alternative for story awards is to consider that the story IS the CR of the party level (since it was written for their level). Then just award XP for completing it as they faced a rather long encounter (that wrapped around all the encounters that made up the story). The XP for CR generally follows the formula of 300XP per CR (300 * CR). So defeating the BBEG and saving the princess is worth an extra 300 * P, in addition to the XP the party got for defeating the BBEG directly.
Math is hard.
Lanefan
Victoria Rules
Many of the ideas discussed here, while sound, have one fatal flaw: they reward the do-nothing character just as often and as well as the character that sticks its neck out. So where's the in-game benefit of taking a risk?
Keeping the party all the same level regardless of any other factors just isn't that important...if a few characters have, in the long run, done more and-or survived longer, they *should* be higher level than their less-involved and-or newer replacements. And there's a fairness factor to consider: if Joe's played in your game since Day 1 and has run his character from raw 1st all the way to 12th, why should I as a new player expect to be able to bring my PC in also at 12th, without having done all the work to get there? (now, if once I come in, my PC does enough to eventually catch and pass Joe, that's different...)
That said, there's some good ideas here about what ExP should be given out *for*, other than straight combat...I might swipe one or two...
Lanefan
Keeping the party all the same level regardless of any other factors just isn't that important...if a few characters have, in the long run, done more and-or survived longer, they *should* be higher level than their less-involved and-or newer replacements. And there's a fairness factor to consider: if Joe's played in your game since Day 1 and has run his character from raw 1st all the way to 12th, why should I as a new player expect to be able to bring my PC in also at 12th, without having done all the work to get there? (now, if once I come in, my PC does enough to eventually catch and pass Joe, that's different...)
That said, there's some good ideas here about what ExP should be given out *for*, other than straight combat...I might swipe one or two...
Lanefan
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