Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is coming! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Paladins with powers being deluded/deceived?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Umbran" data-source="post: 6267790" data-attributes="member: 177"><p>Yep. </p><p></p><p>Let's look at the 3.5 SRD:</p><p></p><p><em>"A paladin who ceases to be lawful good, who willfully commits an evil act, or who grossly violates the code of conduct loses all paladin spells and abilities...</em></p><p><em>She regains her abilities and advancement potential if she atones for her violations (see the atonement spell description), as appropriate."</em></p><p></p><p>So, it is "willfully commits an evil act" or "grossly violates the code". </p><p></p><p>Reading strictly, gross violations do not need to be willful - strict liability, it seems. If you are dominated or controlled or deceived into a major violation, *poof*, there go your powers. This probably requires a bit of setup - the bad guy probably has to know the code in detail, has to provide the nudge in the right time and place and situation where a violation is apt to happen, and have that violation be successful, and large enough to be considered "gross".</p><p></p><p>Also, strictly speaking, either willful evil or gross violation can be fixed through atonement. The issue is not permanent.</p><p></p><p>With a less strict reading, (with willfully applying to evil acts *and* gross violations) this is a non-issue. The paladin is then not bound by strict liability, and cannot be duped or influenced into violations to lose status.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p> And always have a 9th level cleric as a friend <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, it is kind of a jerk move for a GM to toss such a thing at a paladin who has no real ability to resist at all.</p><p></p><p>But, no hope? The condition can be alleviated, so there is hope. If the transgression was not willful, Atonement has no cost to the caster!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Umbran, post: 6267790, member: 177"] Yep. Let's look at the 3.5 SRD: [I]"A paladin who ceases to be lawful good, who willfully commits an evil act, or who grossly violates the code of conduct loses all paladin spells and abilities... She regains her abilities and advancement potential if she atones for her violations (see the atonement spell description), as appropriate."[/I] So, it is "willfully commits an evil act" or "grossly violates the code". Reading strictly, gross violations do not need to be willful - strict liability, it seems. If you are dominated or controlled or deceived into a major violation, *poof*, there go your powers. This probably requires a bit of setup - the bad guy probably has to know the code in detail, has to provide the nudge in the right time and place and situation where a violation is apt to happen, and have that violation be successful, and large enough to be considered "gross". Also, strictly speaking, either willful evil or gross violation can be fixed through atonement. The issue is not permanent. With a less strict reading, (with willfully applying to evil acts *and* gross violations) this is a non-issue. The paladin is then not bound by strict liability, and cannot be duped or influenced into violations to lose status. And always have a 9th level cleric as a friend :) Yes, it is kind of a jerk move for a GM to toss such a thing at a paladin who has no real ability to resist at all. But, no hope? The condition can be alleviated, so there is hope. If the transgression was not willful, Atonement has no cost to the caster! [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Paladins with powers being deluded/deceived?
Top