PC Gamer: OGL not worth fighting for.

[Bayushi_seikuro]

The fundamental problem is that 3PP weren't creating stuff for D&D because they loved WotC or something. They were doing it because there was money to be made. It's easy for a player to talk about switching to another system, but there are a plethora of possibilities, which creates huge risk for 3PP.

So much of RPG gaming being centred on D&D via the OGL created a consumer base that kept a lot of 3PP sustainable. Yes, I profoundly support folks making things that aren't D&D (frankly, I am not that interested in non D&D RPGs unless they are really not D&D). But I don't have to make a living. If the RPG scene completely fractures, that will destroy most small 3PP, at least in the short term. That is why simply walking away from the OGL is not necessarily a feasible option for a lot of folks.

Those of us who are not 3PP should be careful about getting on our high horses and making hyperbolic proclamations. There are a lot of people whose livelihoods are at stake. Mine isn't.

Exactly this. It's about what can be gained by people using a connection to D&D's legacy and the fact that for the general, non-gaming masses, 'D&D' is a term for all gaming like Kleenex is for tissues.

I have seen ZERO vitriol towards Steve Jackson Games, for example, saying this on their website: (Note, also like Wizard's statements, SJG specifically includes computer implementation and MUDs/MUSHes/etc or anything cobbled together at home/school)

"No . . . it's not legal to take the GURPS rules and base a game on them without formal permission. SJ Games is open to licensing inquiries from professional developers – contact licensing@sjgames.com – but, to preserve system integrity and protect the possibility of a professional computer implementation, the company does not grant permission for "homebrew" games or M*s to use the GURPS name and rules."

 

[Jaeger]

I don't agree with everything said in the article.

But this:

Skyrim is popular, but imagine if almost all PC gaming was just Skyrim or Skyrim mods. Imagine if the majority of people had never played or perhaps even heard of any other PC games, and that the mainstream media saw Skyrim as the entirety of the industry. That's essentially where the TTRPG hobby has been at, on-and-off, since its inception. ...

He's not wrong...

The vast swath of D&D players completely unwilling to even try another game is something unique to RPG's compared to the computer gaming industry.

Most RPG players are not "gamers" in the general sense. Most RPG players are specifically D&D gamers.

 

[eyeheartawk]

"No . . . it's not legal to take the GURPS rules and base a game on them without formal permission. SJ Games is open to licensing inquiries from professional developers – contact licensing@sjgames.com – but, to preserve system integrity and protect the possibility of a professional computer implementation, the company does not grant permission for "homebrew" games or M*s to use the GURPS name and rules."

On that note, maybe, they should, just maybe, been more open to that agreement with Fallout back in the day. Bet you they've kicked themselves over that since 1997.

 

[Jack Daniel]

While I certainly have no problem with gamers who enjoy a variety of systems, it gets tiresome to see this hipsterish demonization of D&D get trotted out again and again.

The very Skyrim analogy that appears in the PC Gamer article was used in a thread over on r/rpg not too long ago, and that's a space notorious for seething at D&D's perennial popularity and sneering at the "wargame" that serves as the gateway into the real hobby.

Speaking as one of the benighted D&D-only gamers, this attitude will never persuade me to broaden my horizons. Indeed, it only repels and disgusts me whenever anyone tries to liken "not playing other RPGs" to "not playing other video games", "not reading other books", "not watching non-Marvel movies," or anything along those lines. They're inapt, condescending analogies.

How about: "I'll stick to D&D, the same way that a poker player doesn't need to take up contract bridge, and a chess player doesn't need to devote their time to checkers, merely because these tangentially-related hobbies happen to share some similar gaming equipment"?

 

[Solauren]

Most RPG players are not "gamers" in the general sense. Most RPG players are specifically D&D gamers.

True. But the question is, why?

D&D was the first RPG really. So, it's the widest spread. The others that have come, are trying not to be D&D, so they may not appeal to as wide an audience. Systems may not be alike at all, and that can be off putting.

That's not a problem with video games, as really, while the background engines and code are going to be different, it's all via the keyboard, joystick, mouse or gamepad. Same basic interface when you get down to it. (Your eyes, your hands).

That's probably why the D20 system was so popular. In addition to the core D&D/Fantasy game, you also had variety systems that covered it all. How many D20 licenses were not Fantasy based? How many where but for stuff that TSR couldn't/wouldn't touch?

Learn the basic d20 system, and you could move to the others with ease.

Outside of that, learn one system, and it probably didn't apply to another. (i.e Try playing RIFTS, COC, Marvel Super-heroes, Star Trek FASA, AD&D2E, and then GURPS, and try not to start trying to swap parts around to get a better overall system)

 

[Sacrosanct]

The fundamental problem is that 3PP weren't creating stuff for D&D because they loved WotC or something. They were doing it because there was money to be made. It's easy for a player to talk about switching to another system, but there are a plethora of possibilities, which creates huge risk for 3PP.

So much of RPG gaming being centred on D&D via the OGL created a consumer base that kept a lot of 3PP sustainable. Yes, I profoundly support folks making things that aren't D&D (frankly, I am not that interested in non D&D RPGs unless they are really not D&D). But I don't have to make a living. If the RPG scene completely fractures, that will destroy most small 3PP, at least in the short term. That is why simply walking away from the OGL is not necessarily a feasible option for a lot of folks.

Those of us who are not 3PP should be careful about getting on our high horses and making hyperbolic proclamations. There are a lot of people whose livelihoods are at stake. Mine isn't.

Yep. Anecdotally, my biggest project last year was Twilight Fables. I spent nearly $60,000 on it. I made that back. Because it was 5e compatible. I also put out an OSE version of it because some people asked. Of the two versions (available at the same time), 95% of customers had the 5e version. Only 5% choose the OSE version. And the OSE is still D&D, for intents and purposes.

There is no way I could have created that book for any other system, even one I might personally like better than 5e. Not a chance in the frozen heck.

 

[eyeheartawk]

While I certainly have no problem with gamers who enjoy a variety of systems, it gets tiresome to see this hipsterish demonization of D&D get trotted out again and again.

I think there is a difference between flannel wearing Forge types on Twitter hating D&D with every tweet every day because they couldn't find anybody to play Life with Master with or whatever and what we're talking about here.

 

[Aspirinsmurf]

There is no way I could have created that book for any other system, even one I might personally like better than 5e. Not a chance in the frozen heck.

Indeed. Commercially, it would be like releasing a PC game that doesn't run on Windows. That's suicide.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Indeed. Commercially, it would be like releasing a PC game that doesn't run on Windows. That's suicide.

OR Mac. it would be like releasing a video game that only runs on MorphOS.

 

[mamba]

True. But the question is, why?

D&D was the first RPG really. So, it's the widest spread. The others that have come, are trying not to be D&D, so they may not appeal to as wide an audience. Systems may not be alike at all, and that can be off putting.

to a degree you are correct, but 1/2e vs 3e vs 4e vs 5e are very different games in their own right (some closer to each other than their immediate successor).

Esp. in todays market you can find ones closer to 5e than that is to say 4e