Permanency scroll cost

[kreynolds]

But, when you place a spell on a scroll (a spell completion item), I believe that you must specify everything (except the target) when the scroll is created.

You don't have to specify the range for ranged spells. Otherwise, that would make a fireball a preguided missile spell, which would be kinda silly.

This seems to indicate that you must decide what effect will be made permanent when the scroll is created.

Not really. You don't have to predefine everything.

I'm not sure what would happen if you read a scroll that made Darvision permanent, but didn't have a Darvision spell currently in effect.

Nothing at all would happen and the scroll would be used up.

Then again, any mage creating such a scroll would probably also place a Darkvision spell on it as well, for convenience.

Kinda like how I previously suggested?

 

[BigAl]

kreynolds:
"You don't have to specify the range for ranged spells. "

I'm not sure if that's true - I seem to recall the PHB mentioning that everything must be specified except the target (sorry, don't have my PHB here at work, I can't give a page number or even verify that right now)

So using a scroll of fireball, you would have to specify maximum range when creating the scroll (within the caster level maximum) - but the scroll reader could shoose any target within the range that was set. Although I also think that maximum range is based on the caster level of the scroll, and is not the scroll creator's decision.

And yes, including Darkvision on the scroll was your idea and a darn good one too!

- Al

 

[kreynolds]

I'm not sure if that's true - I seem to recall the PHB mentioning that everything must be specified except the

This...

So using a scroll of fireball, you would have to specify maximum range when creating the scroll (within the caster level maximum)

...is not the same as this.

The maximum range of the fireball in the scroll would be determined automatically by the caster level, which is the only thing you must define when scribing the fireball spell into the scroll. When the scroll is then activated, the user simply specifices range and direction and lets it fly. The range can be anything he wants within the maximum limits.

 

[IceBear]

I think it was clarified that range didn't have to be predetermined, if it does indeed say that.

IceBear

 

[kreynolds]

Although I also think that maximum range is based on the caster level of the scroll, and is not the scroll creator's decision.

Not exactly. The creator of the scroll sets the caster level of the spell within the scroll. That caster level then defines the limitations of the spell as normal (range, damage, etc). This applies to all magic items that store spells.

 

[kreynolds]

I think it was clarified that range didn't have to be predetermined, if it does indeed say that.

It doesn't say that in the SRD, and my books are in my car, so I'll grab them on my next smoke break.

 

[Belares]

Also doesn't the user of said item know the limitations of the scroll, staff, etc? If so you can use this knowledge to do what you wish with the spell.

 

[IceBear]

Problem with that is how do you handle found magic items. I wouldn't want to keep track of different scrolls that I found, noting all their pertinent data, when just noting the caster level is sufficient.

IceBear

 

[Belares]

I wouldn't want to keep track of different scrolls that I found, noting all their pertinent data, when just noting the caster level is sufficient.

I think that is exactly it on knowing what the spell can do.

 

[kreynolds]

Also doesn't the user of said item know the limitations of the scroll, staff, etc? If so you can use this knowledge to do what you wish with the spell.

If you identify it, yes. If you play in FR, the scroll might very well be self identifying.