PHB Length and Contents

[Sunseeker]

I'd like to see a farily large and comprehensive PHB. Now, provided they release a Starter Box, that's fine to include a more concise version, but I'd want the full-text PHB to come out along-side it. And with the prices on books these days, I'd like to see it be fairly massive @300ish pages.

 

[Skyscraper]

I'd like to have one PHB per player at my table.

Easier to look up rules.

Oh wait, the question said how long, not how many...

 

[CasvalRemDeikun]

I vote for the standard 320 pages. Content as follows:
Races: Twelve races, two-three pages each for 24-36 pages
Classes: Twelve classes, five to ten pages each, for 60-120 pages
Themes: Twenty themes, three pages each, for 60 pages
Gear: Ten pages
Skills: Ten pages
Feats: Twenty pages
Spells: Thirty pages
Miscellaneous stuff (combat rules, out of combat rules, etc.): Forty pages

 

[underfoot007ct]

Nerf these and save space and trees:

Kits/Themes - 20 pages (class customization and background)
Skills - 10 pages
Feats/Talents - 20 pages (or maneuvers or whatever)

Since we already know:

• A skill is essentially a notation to a stat. For example, STR 15, and bonus to opening jam jars because you're just really good at that particular thing.
• Feats cover at-will abilities. Wizard has javelin of fire at-will feat ability.
• Themes cover potion-makers and blacksmiths. Like kits from 2E. You can improve in that theme with feats etc. Or you can use skills and feats to customize your own theme.
• Themes such as commoner, noble, knight, apprentice. Also planetouched, deva, avenger. There is one called "pub crawler". So you can have an avenger themed paladin.
• Themes tie into open-ended skill system - skills for specific themes.

Better add about 60 pages for the Skills, Feats, & Themes.

 

[howandwhy99]

I thought I posted an answer already, pretty recently too. Edit: I think @200 pages could do it justice for what I wrote.

Olgar made a similar thread about a month ago just after the announcement. I have a couple posts on parts of what could be in the DMG too.

 

[Khaalis]

I totally agree with Tallifer.

Dungeons & Dragons (Like the early 80's 3rd version - Starters)
* Basic Set (magenta box)
* Expert Set (light blue box)

Advanced Dungeons & Dragons
* A full, heavy page count (300+) PHB with all of the options (Basic + all modular addons)
* Plus the DMG & MM

The worst thing would be for the Players' Handbook to cater only to the minimalist crowd. Not everyone wants to re-create the Fellowship of the Ring ad nauseum.

I also like the split between Basic and Advanced because I don't want to see a spread of the classic "no splatbook" mentality to spread to what should be a full set of advanced rules. If only the Basic Set style rules are in the PHB1 and all "Advanced Modular Rules" are in PHB2, you start to run into the exact problem WotC is trying to avoid. They want to be able to have multiple styles of play mixed, but if you have people who basically say "If its not in the PHB1 its not allowed at my table" you might as well not have gone through the effort of making the new modular system.

Additionally, as to page count, most gamers aren't afraid to read, or if they are, the hobby should help put people back on the path of reading. I personally want a TOME, not a pamphlet. Minimalist text just for the sake of being minimalist seems lazy to me, but I may just be a grognard on that count.

 

[kitsune9]

I hope it falls within 64 pages (classes, races, equipment, combat, and spells). Let the DMG be 128 to handle the other core rules (everything else). The DM can decide on themes, feats, skills, etc.).

However, if all of that is to be in a PH, then I would say 128 pages. I think a couple of issues with the current systems is that there is too much rule bloat from the outset. It's cool to have 100 feats, 35 skills, and 300 spells, but I think it can be cut down some. I love Pathfinder, but it's a 500 page rulebook, so that's too intimidating to use to try to get new players (hence the need for their beautiful Beginner Box).

 

[BluSponge]

Count me in as one of those who favors a strict page count. I'd really like to see what the designers could do if you forced them to be as efficient as possible. I kinda think 128 pages might be a bit too strict though. 1st edition did it, but most of the rules got added into the DMG – and besides, the players already had their LBBs to play the game from. Something more along the lines of the 2nd edition PHB might be more realistic, though at 128 you would completely eliminate the intimidation factor.

But what I think may be more important for DDN will be the price point. I can't imagine dropping north of $100 to run DDN. I think if WotC really wants it to take off, they need to do what they did with 3e. Get the PHB to a $20-25 price point, and the whole set needs to go for less than $100 (maybe $20 PHB, $30 MM, and $35 DMG, for a $85 buy in). There are just too many more options out there these days.

But then I'm also an advocate of revisiting the BECMI model of rule releases, and that changes the ballgame somewhat. Even so, I kinda like the idea of the players book as seperately available, and still around the $20 range.

Oh, and I'm also one of those people who wants his DMG to be twice the size of the PHB.

Tom

 

[Beastman]

...
Magic - 50 pages (6 spells/page - around 300 spells)

I would also prefer a smaller book, about 150 to 200 pages, but not with 50 pages of spells. I don't want about 1/3rd of the book to be filled with spells.

 

[delericho]

My preference is very much for an end to the three-book model - give us a single Core Rulebook of about 250 pages. And if your game is so complex it doesn't fit in that space, it's too complex.

However, if they do decide to retain the three-book model, then they should do it properly - give us a PHB of 300ish pages, and absolutely pack it with good stuff. That is, lots of races, lots of classes, lots of powers.

If I'm buying one book, I have no objection to buying supplements as and when I want them. If I'm paying $100+ for the core rules, I expect to play for at least a year out of that investment.

Either way, a really good Starter Set, released on the same day as the core rules, is an absolute must.