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Message: <blockquote data-quote="evilbob" data-source="post: 3621972" data-attributes="member: 9789">Well, since I never said that, I'll have to go with "no."  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  Do you think your post kills babies?  (A joke:  also a non sequitur.)Actually, I believe this statement to be incorrect, based on my experience.I'm currently running a game around 11th level with a fighter and a tricked-out super cleric using the persistant metamagic trick, and my experience in their damage output has been the following:  if both the fighter and the cleric are given all the time they need to prepare for a situation, the cleric can occationally - at certain levels - do slightly more damage on average than the fighter.  This is solely due to the cleric's ability to mimic high-level items with spells (such as divine power).  However, this is not consistant at each level, and in the long run, the fighter will always do more damage.  Why?  One word:  feats.  The cleric uses almost all his feats to power his metamagic trick, and even if he didn't he still doesn't get enough feats to duplicate the fighter's feat progression.  The fighter can simply raise his damage consistantly with feats, and the cleric - even super magicked-up - cannot keep up.  Once they both start getting powerful items that are as good as the the buffs from the cleric's spells, it's really all over.  And all of this is pre-supposing that the cleric has all the time he needs to prepare.  In reality, this only happens at best around half the time.  Granted, this percentage actually does go up the higher level the character are, but at that point the race is already lost.  All those little +1 feats really do make a difference.  (This just goes even further - at least in my opinion - to show why the MWM feat is broken as-written.)Now don't get me wrong:  I'm not saying the cleric isn't a great character, super powerful, useful in so many other ways, blah blah blah - I'm just saying that in the SOLE category of raw average damage, he is not as good as a fighter, and cannot hope to be over the long run.  That's all.Actually, I've never played in a game without a straight-classed melee character.  We have two in my game right now.</blockquote>

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