D&D 5E Playing beyond 20th level options - homebrews, 3rd party content

[Casimir Liber]

My PCs have reached 20th level and I have some ideas for further adventures. So of course DMG has giving PCs epic boons every 30,000xp or so (I DM with xp), but it comes over as pretty rudimentary and basic. I just got 2C Gaming's Epic Legacy Core Rulebook and am digesting now. Pondering what other people have done (if anyone) as can't see previous threads discussing this.

Has been interesting/challenging developing higher level adventures but we've had some fun and I have a good idea for a (semi) climactic one now.

 

[jgsugden]

I implemented a pretty simple system for "Epic Classes". Each of these classes is 10 levels. When you advance a level beyond 20th, you can either take a level in these classes, if you meet the prerequisites, or you can multiclass as normal. The 4 Epic Classes are: Spellweaver, Martial, Leader and Shadow.

Spellweavers are very simple. You have to be a 20th level single class caster (bard, cleric, druid, sorcerer, wizard) to take a level as a spellweaver. At each level you gain a spellslot and you get to pick one spell that is always prepared/known. The slots, gained one per level, are: 6, 7, 8, 8, 9, 9, 10, 10, 11, 12. I have homebrew spells of levels 10 to 12. HP gains per level are a d6.

Martial is more complex, but essentially it just ramps up your speed. You get more attacks, more movement, higher AC, etc... You also gain Legendary Resistances and Legendary Actions. You also gain 2d8 hp per level. You need to have 20th level in a single class to take it.

Leaders gain auras. Each level you can either add a new aura or enhance the radius of an existing aura. Auras heal, grant resistances or immunities, cause fear saves in enemies, etc... You also gain proficiency/expertise in skills and get a "minimum ability score" that drags up any low scores you have so that by the time you're 30th level, you have no ability score below 18. HP gains are d8. You need to have 20th level in a single class to take it.

Shadows are the stealth/scout build option. You need to have a 20 or higher dexterity, 20 levels in a single class, and proficiency in stealth. They get 10 different abilities which only a person that has taken them gets to know, generally. These are supernatural abilities (magic that does not use the arcane weave) that allow them to do the impossible including passing through walls, being in two places at once, and negating everything that happened to you during the last round (even if you were killed). They gain a d8 per level.

Advancement to the next level requires a legendary act. Legendary acts are not just 'killed an ancient red dragon' - they're changing the course of history in a way that will be spoken of for generations.

 

[Uni-the-Unicorn!]

There are two or three epic options on DMsGuild. The most well regarded is simply called “Epic Characters,” IIRC.

I have also seen some free fan made homebrew ones too.

 

[dave2008]

I have epic legacy and it is a fine work and they have some support for it. I personally don't care for their approach, but it is a pretty common take on epic level play.

Here are some epic (past 20) options available on the DMs Guild:
Epic Options (basically a riff on epic characters below)
Epic Characters (there are some follow up settings, bestiaries, and adventures by this author.
Epic Rules Expansion
Epic Variant
Epic Destinies
More Epic Boons

Here are some more resources I found with an internet search
Epic Levels (note this link is directly to the PDF)
Epic Levels, Ascension, Godhood, & Divine Rank (wiki)
D&D 5e Epic Boons (GM Binder - many more boons and class specific boons)
Epic Levels (GM Binder - only goes to 25th level, but appears very thorough)

Of course I have my own rules that I am working on, but I wouldn't wait for me to finish. Additionally, @Upper_Krust is coming out with an epic/immortal level supplement that will put the rest to shame, but it may be to late for what you are looking for.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hi there Casimir Liber!

...and thanks for the mention dave2008 buddy.

I think the three main problems with epic gaming (in 5e) are accessibility, balance and resources.

Any kind of advancing beyond the core 20 levels is some degree of added complexity. That will likely dissuade new player's from trying it. That said, 5e is much less complicated than certainly 3 or 4e.

Challenge Rating is a tricky thing to understand (just ask WotC). Above level 10 or so it can be difficult to accurately gauge and build encounters (though I think I have solved this issue myself).

There are very few epic resources within the core rules. I haven't personally bought any of the 2C Gaming epic material myself (because I didn't want it to colour my own rules which are coming in 2024) so I only have a passing familiarity to it. However, I think if you are simply planning to take things to Level 30 then 2C Gaming is probably the way to go.

As regards my own epic and immortal rules, I don't extend class levels beyond 20th. Instead you get divine ranks (from 1-30) which add on top of your class levels. Divine ranks are a power boost. Immortals are then customised by choosing Portfolios (God of War, or Strength or Magic etc.). Each divine rank is the equivalent to 5-6 class levels. So at Divine rank 30 (supreme being) you are effectively Level 200...although the boosts are not linear. For context, greater gods like Zeus and Odin are Divine Rank 6. This system allows you to replicate ANY possible Manga, Anime, Books, Comics, Movies you can imagine - no matter how overpowered, and it will still hold together. So you could conceivably have a party of PC's like Goku from Dragonball, a 'Q' from Star Trek, Infinity Gauntlet Thanos, Lord Ao from Forgotten Realms and Superman 1 million. Of course the bulk of the system focuses on the classic immortal ranks (1-6). So if you just want to play characters only slightly more powerful than a level 20 character you can stick to the first few divine ranks. I'm still working on everything but should have the Kickstarter ready for early 2024.

 

[Casimir Liber]

thanks all - plenty to digest here!

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hello again Casimir Liber!

thanks all - plenty to digest here!

I would also add that it helps in epic games if the players really want the power. Role-playing is one thing, but a few power gamers in the group will help propel things along.

Additionally, I would say it's always better to ascend characters that have been played a long time, rather than creating new ones. In epic games the stakes can be so high it's easy to lose that personal touch.

 

[Theory of Games]

My PCs have reached 20th level and I have some ideas for further adventures. So of course DMG has giving PCs epic boons every 30,000xp or so (I DM with xp), but it comes over as pretty rudimentary and basic. I just got 2C Gaming's Epic Legacy Core Rulebook and am digesting now. Pondering what other people have done (if anyone) as can't see previous threads discussing this.

Has been interesting/challenging developing higher level adventures but we've had some fun and I have a good idea for a (semi) climactic one now.

How high level are you assuming to go? Where does it stop? Call me crazy but some characters find a finish spot, like Gandalf wasn't trying to take over Middle Earth. He was cool with being a counselor. He found a spot for retirement. Where, and I know this is insane, would you consider your PC finishing? TPK?

 

[Casimir Liber]

They've hit 20th level (having played from 1st) and I've thought of another adventure - so at present thinking they'll just get to 21st or maybe 22nd level before stopping (or pausing I guess - if I think of another one)

 

[the Jester]

I have pcs with up to ten epic boons in my game at this point. I've been doing a lot of homebrewing custom epic boons designed specifically around a pc's desired epic level identity. So if you're a bad ass monk, some kind of custom thing designed for how you fight, or maybe an option to boost your (something something monkish), etc, a single 10th level spell slot, more lower level spell slots, etc.