Plot Killer: Detect evil

[blargney]

Here are a few more options:

1) (contact)'s story hours work on the assumption that every character has an alignment for mechanics purposes, but in reality they are free to act however they want.

2) You can always stock the world with many many many evil people. It's all those folks who cut you off without signalling when you're driving, empty the toilet paper without replacing it, don't recycle, work for unethical companies because they pay well, pursue power for power's sake...

The end result is that using Detect Evil just tells you that the world is full of lousy people. It's not a very cheery solution, but it's a solution!

-blarg

 

[MerakSpielman]

If a paladin is using too much Detect Evil, have somebody cast Misdirection on HIM so that HE radiates evil. See how he likes getting singled out on that basis and that basis alone.

Things are not always as they seem, and Detect Evil is only the preliminary stage of a detective story.

 

[FrankTrollman]

Even if it's defined in your game as detecting anyone who has an evil alignment, it still means nothing, as most societies will want proof of evil actions, I would think.

A Paladin cannot lie and detects Evil with the power of Truth. That he has detected Evil is proof - as good as finger prints or DNA.

The real question, of course - is "so what?"

Remember that aura strength is the big deal here - most everything Evil just detects as an "Evil Creature" - which means that they only show up as more than Faint if they have eleven hit dice.

That means that Lord Protho of the Iron Chair probably only detects faintly. Those Orcs who have come to the city to trade detect just as much individually. That Doppelganger Assassin only has a faint aura - so does the Fiendish Viper that an apprentice wizard summons as part of his studies.

Unless you live in a very polarized world indeed - that Faint Aura just doesn't mean jack. And that's what you get in most cases.

Now, if you do see a moderate aura - you can pretty much go to town on them and most lawful societies will applaud your actions.

-Frank

 

[MerakSpielman]

That he has detected Evil is proof...

And what is the paladin obligated to do about it? Surely he cannot smite all that lie before him. He would be arrested for murder, and if he fought against imprisonment and punishment, he would likely be striking against good people. Just because farmer Jones has been known to steal cows and re-brand them as his own should not earn him a death sentence from the first paladin to wander idly by.

Honestly, how many totally selfish people do you know in real life? People who woundn't think twice about making people miserable just for the hell of it? Who do cold and callous acts - more than just pranks - because they don't like something about you? Do you honestly think they deserve to be executed?

The generic Code of Conduct for a paladin, as stated in the PHB:

A paladin must be of lawful good alignment and loses all special class abilities if she ever willingly commits an act of evil. Additionally, a paladin's code requries that she respect legitimate authority, act with honor (not lying, cheating, not using poison, etc.), help those who need help (provided they do not use the help for evil or chaotic ends), and punish those that harm or threaten innocents.

Let's break this down.
Rule 1) Must be LG. Loses all paladin abilities if commits an evil act.
What is an evil act? Ultimately, this is in the hands of the DM to truly decide. Personally, I would rule that murder is evil. Just because somebody is themselves evil does not mean that killing them is not murder. Superman is LG, and he turns crooks in to the police rather then killing them. Why does he do this? Becuse callous killing of those who you consider evil isn't right. Self defense is one thing, killing in cold blood is another. If your foe throws down their weapons and surrenders, it is evil to kill them, even if the enemy is Orcus himself.

Rule 2) Must respect legitimate authority.
Again, ultimately, the definition of legitimate authority can vary from DM to DM. Does a good conquerer taking over an evil kingdom represent legitimacy? What about an evil conqurer taking over an evil kingdom? A good kingdom? If the local mayer runs a smuggling ring, does that mean the paladin can't act to shut it down, because it is sanctioned by the local authority? Such is the stuff of which paladin moral dillemas are crafted. In the D&D world, though, good is firmly defined. If those in power use their influence to better themselves at the expense of the people, I think a paladin would take action, legitimate authority be damned. Is it worth risking his paladinhood to see the people released from the yoke of tyranny? If the answer is yes, then probably the cause is just. A good leader acts for the benifit of those in his charge. If the leader fails to do so, then they no longer represent legitimate authority. If they do represent legitimacy, then the paladin is bound to treat the authority with due respect (but not, please note, outright obedience).

3) Must act with honor (not lie, cheat, use poison...)
I would personally put steal on this list as well. This is different than being Good. A good person can lie/cheat/steal/use poison. Think James Bond, Han Solo, any undercover cop. A good rogue would steal into an enemy camp and coup-de-grace the enemy leader while they slept. The paladin would rather openly challange this leader to one-on-one combat by broad daylight. He will accept surrenders, even from evil beings, and never break his word, though it destroy him. As such, the word of a paladin is sacrasanct and rarely given, but always true. The paladin is the paragon of ultimate virtue, incorrigably good, and never false. If you trust a valuable item to a paladin and die before you can recover it, he will not sell it or set it aside, but restore it to your loved ones or do whatever in his judgement he thinks you would want him to do.

4) Must help those who need help
Everybody needs help of some sort. Does this mean that, because a paladin wanders by your farm the day after your best hand quit, you can expect him to help you bring in the harvest? Careful, he probably would, should you ask, but you would be wise not to waste the time of a champion of virtue on so mundane a task. Being threatened by orc raids, though, go ahead and ask him if he can do something about that. The paladin really decides who needs his services the most, and acts accordingly, following his code as best he can. If he is on a mission where time is vital and lives are on the line, he probably can't stop to help with the orcs, though he'll be back as soon as he can, or send somebody who is capable of helping sooner. Paladins offer a specific brand of help - it is known that they stand against the forces of evil - so one would hope that people wouldn't ask for their help if they didn't really think they needed it. If a situation does not require the specilization of a paladin, he will politely inform the querant of such, and be on his way.

5) Punish those who harm or threaten innocents
What are "innocents?" Good question. I would say that, in a given conflict, the innocents are those who don't pick a side, but just try to go on with their normal, everyday lives. The People. Commoners, Experts, Aristocrats. Those who, without the forces of Good to defend them, would be almost naked before the forces of Evil that threaten. Definately children would be innocents.
The paladin must also establish that the intent to harm or threaten exists. They are not bound to take action without proof. Without adiquate proof, the paladin becomes an investigator, seeking to determine whether a threat exists or not, and whether it is something simply to be reported to the guards or dealt with in person.
You can be evil and not seek to harm innocents. If you are a demonologist who seeks to commune with demons so you might join them in hell, but you do so from the privacy of your own isolated tower and don't seek to harm anybody, you are not seeking to harm innocents.
It might also be possible to be good and seeking to harm innocents, though an example fails me at the moment. This person would be punished by the paladin.
Note the use of the word "punish." It does not say "kill," though if there is no other way to accomplish eliminating the threat to the innocents a paladin will resort to deadly force. The punishment, though, should match the deed. Trying to turn the populace of a city into lycanthropes is one thing, but a merchant regularly cheating his customers is quite another. The paladin must be wise and use his mandate carefully, not extracting punishment greater than the deed warrents. Often, a simple warning from the local paladin might suffice for minor threats to innocents.


Nowhere in the paladin's code does it say that their mission is to erradicate evil from the world using whatever means they have available. A paladin is much more than a detect-smite machine. They are not a law unto themselves, and must answer to a higher authority. Killing an unarmed or defenseless foe is evil, whatever the justification.

The ends do not justify the means. Ever. A paladin knows this, and abides by his code. Unto death, if need be.

 

[Felix]

AEG's Empires handles this very well. The way they frame it is that someone might be Evil, but they are very good at what they do; ie, maybe the Minister of Trade is a ruthless coldhearted bastard, but he enriches the nation through prosperous trade and in so doing improves the lives of all, poor innocent peasants included.

Meanwhile, the Minister of Justice might be as Good a man as possible, but through his inept bungling of policy the country has run into a crime wave so bad as to make people fear for their lives.

Basically, they suggest that Good /= good at something, nor does Evil = bad at something. So you might have an EEEEEvil king, but he is the best king ever. If you have read Ender's Game by Orson Scott Card, think Peter Wiggin. Evil jerk, heaven-sent hegemon.

 

[LostSoul]

Here are a few more options:
The end result is that using Detect Evil just tells you that the world is full of lousy people. It's not a very cheery solution, but it's a solution!

-blarg

That's what I do in games where Detect spells work as per the PHB. Just because you meet an evil bartender, who cares? Maybe he just cheats on his wife. And if he's the "End Boss", he's either going to be obviously Evil (living in a dungeon surrounded by monsters kinda gives it away) or warded with any number of spells or magic items.

In my campaign, I use Detect Evil to detect all supernatural creatures. Even the Good ones.

 

[Blue Sky]

A Paladin cannot lie and detects Evil with the power of Truth. That he has detected Evil is proof - as good as finger prints or DNA.

While the paladin might be able to convince himself that an evil aura is proof, he will never be able to use it as proof in any society.

Characters don't walk around with signs listing their class. There is nothing the paladin can do that another class cannot do. Laying on Hands? Silent, Still Cure Light Wounds. Cure Disease? See above. Turn Undead? "I haven't yet reached that level of devotion, sire."

Not to mention paladins might not even be considered champions of "Good" in the society he's in. A paladin from FR's Halruaa might be devoted to the goddess of magic, and consider it his holy duty to protect the high wizards of his home country. And that Orc king, who's leading his forces in attacks against the King's Own Castle? Sure, according to rumor, he's a vicious, evil killer, but what if he's a paladin, leading his people against the King who's hunting his kind to extinction.

Remember, we know he's a paladin, with x, y, and z as class features, but there's no way for the people in the game to know that.

 

[Hand of Evil]

While the paladin might be able to convince himself that an evil aura is proof, he will never be able to use it as proof in any society.

I think they would as witch hunters and in a society where might makes right, these are extremes. This is why I define evil, listing them out, the player detects evil and then has to look at the list and wonder what he is picking up.

 

[Hand of Evil]

double post

 

[Elder-Basilisk]

Unless you live in a very polarized world indeed - that Faint Aura just doesn't mean jack. And that's what you get in most cases.

Definitely true.

Now, if you do see a moderate aura - you can pretty much go to town on them and most lawful societies will applaud your actions.

-Frank

"can...go to town on them" is a pretty amibiguous statement here. People from highly successful evil commoners and experts (lvl 12+) to low level evil priests to mid-tier evil outsiders and undead to ancient evil dragons and epic level evil ghostwalkers and wizards radiate moderate auras of evil. Even if it's legal and acceptable to go to town on them, going to town on anyone radiating moderate evil is probably a good way to die.