D&D 4E Point buy, 4e & you.

[Stormtalon]

Although, in general, I use random stat generation: 21 dice, assign three to each stats being a nice one.

That's an interesting variant. Hmmmm.... Might have to float this one past my group. I'm sure they'll find it an absolute

 

[Irda Ranger]

Point buy encourages flat, uninteresting stat blocks. Point-for-point opens up characters with both exceptional stats and remarkable flaws.

It also creates overly min-maxed one-trick ponies. You may think your Dwarven Fighter can get by with a 5 in Int and Chr, but game play that involves stuff other than killin' orcs may leave your character on the sidelines for sessions at a time. Well rounded characters allow well-rounded campaigns.

If you want remarkable flaws though, and the rest of the group is on board for that, I don't see the harm is allowing stats below 8. I wouldn't give you more points for doing that, but you get to roleplay it.

Points buy also penalizes character concepts that require two or more high stats.

Your system isn't any better, because point buy has not effect on this. This is an artifact of designing classes with variable MAD (i.e., the Monk has more MAD than the Fighter). To the extent the classes have equal MAD, no stat-gen system is better or worse than any other.

 

[rkwoodard]

agree

Point buy encourages flat, uninteresting stat blocks. Point-for-point opens up characters with both exceptional stats and remarkable flaws. Points buy also penalises character concepts that require two or more high stats.

I much prefer 78 points, spend as you like, to points buy.

Although, in general, I use random stat generation: 21 dice, assign three to each stats being a nice one.

Hi,
Totally agree here. My group (older group 30+) loves rolling stats. Even though we do have the Powerjock that we know cheats. We just go with the flow. They have told me (I am the DM--always) that they prefer rolling even though it gives him an advantage.

RK

 

[Irda Ranger]

Meh. Point-buy is teh lame. 4d6-drop-1 roll-two-sets-take-the-best is the way we've always done it, and I don't see that changing any time soon.

Anything that works is cool. I used this system all through high school, but now I have a regular player who's seriously OCD about rolling set after set if you let them. I had to institute point-buy to nip the tendency in the bud.

You should see the stats their characters in games like Baldur's Gate had though. When you have the patience (neurosis?) to roll hundreds of stat sets you eventually get some crazy scores.

 

[Voss]

Is there some archaic mathematical formulae that I'm missing here? Is there some method to abuse this system that I just don't get? Why make things more complex than they have to be?

A +4 (or 5 with racial modifiers) in your primary stat is almost always more powerful than +2 in multiple stats. With the emphasis on stats for attack and damage values in 4e, this will remain true. Take the sample wizard character from D&DXP- he wouldn't be nearly as useful with a 16 int and a couple other stats raised to 14. It would -2 to every significant action he could take, in exchange for a few extra hit points or a slight init bonus, and slight increases in defenses that, at 1st level, are pretty much a random die roll- 2 points there won't help the wizard as much as being able to hit the enemy more often.

 

[Blackbrrd]

One player rolled something like 18, 18, 17, 16, 15, 14. He wasn't the DMs girlfriend or favourite and rolled with the DM looking. The rest of the party had stats like: 17, 16, 15, 13,10,8.

After this we played with point buy with 32, 30 or 28 points. According to what has is in the "4e fan phb", it will be even more expensive to get an 18. On the other hand, most races have +2 to two ability scores.

 

[keterys]

A wizard's Int adds to his attack, damage, some of his skills, his Reflex save, and his AC... under what circumstances is _any other stat_ worth giving up points of Int?

Only when those other stats are cheaper. Thereby, the increasing cost.

 

[Crothian]

You sound like someone who's never played with a) The DMs girlfriend or b) a slightly-less- than-honest powergamer. Either way, I envy you.

I played with both, I still prefer dice

 

[ShinHakkaider]

You sound like someone who's never played with a) The DMs girlfriend or b) a slightly-less- than-honest powergamer. Either way, I envy you.

Or with a group that you've never played with before in real space and are literally creating PC's via Email. Point-buy is useful in that it makes it that everyone is starting off with some semblance of equality in terms of abilities.

 

[katahn]

The weighted system has the drawback of being a little harder to explain to younger players, which is why I might lean towards the 22pt-non-scaling-cost system. I'll be running at least one of my campaigns with the following:

Me (DM)
Fiance (Player)
My Daughter (12)
Fiance's Son (13)
My Oldest Son (10)
and possibly My Youngest Son (8)

Saying "Ok, your stats are all starting at 8 and you can add 22 points to them wherever you like but nothing higher than an 18" is a bit simpler than trying to explain the more complicated point-buy system.

Now for any campaign I would run with people 16+ or other 30+'ers I'd probably go with the 28pt+weighted system to encourage a bit more in the way of well-rounded characters.