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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Goumindong" data-source="post: 4499627" data-attributes="member: 70874">Not a spoof, but I am glad you have no argument with which to refute mine.No, they really do never come up. They only come up when the DM specifically inputs said [usually ridiculous] situation into the game where it is unnecessary.DnD is a game of solving problems. These problems involve figuring things out, going place, killing monsters, and taking their stuff. Anything that is not involved in that is extraneous and pointless.I am perfectly comfortable saying that if you are in a situation where your "craft armor" check or "perform check" is necessary to advance the plot in a way that simply saying you can craft armor or that you can perform the DM is going out of his way to include a ridiculous situation or has done something wrong. Yes, bad wrong fun, that is you. Now, before you whine about that statement[and you will] consider this. You are taking DnD into an area it does not go. Its a game that figures heroic fantasy. Complaining that crafting and perform are not skills has the same validity as complaining that "craft(lie)", "Craft(plot device)", "Craft(tesla coil)" or that the game isn't taking place on an airplane where everyone got sick by eating the fish. As fun as roleplaying out National Lampoon's "Airplane" would be, its not DnD. And neither is crafting, profession, or perform.But fail to consider that that is pointless. You never have a "play off" with your musical instruments to determine the fate of the world. You never have a "craft off" to determine the fate of the world. This is not "Crossroads", and when it is your DM has made something ridiculous in order to make your otherwise useless skill choice have some meaning. When these things do matter, they can always be adjudicated in the same manner as any other background can be. If you have family in a town, that changes the plot. But you don't pay in skills for the fact that you have family in a town, you just do. By that same token, you do not need to have to pay in skills or even define how good a blacksmith you are, you are a blacksmith and that is good enough. If you need to make something that is important, the DM can easily use all the other skills at his disposal to have you create something. Insight to figure out what thing that needs to be made to convince someone. Perception to see the prongs on a lock so you can make the key. Endurance as you wrestle with the molten hot armor and bash it into the form you need. And of course, an appropriate gold allocation.The key here is that cost in terms of skills to overcome the challenge has not been modified. Whereas with craft skills it has, oftentimes negatively, with regards to characters with backgrounds relating to defined skills.These skills are never conflict resolution mechanics. The do not function in a useful manner where there is a sliding scale of challenge that must be overcome.Actually no. That would be "Profession: Marketer" But of course both of those skills are pointless[as described above]. You are a hero saving the world, you will not ever need to test your ability to book a show, and if by some crazy stretch of the imagination that you do, you have plenty of other skills to make it an interesting skill challenge that your DM can actually describe in an engaging wayMacGyver is also a Deus Ex Machina in the same way that wizards in most fantasy literature are not DnD PC's. They represent the guy who simply wins because of how awesome he is. The difference is that MacGyver is the Deus Ex Machina in a different genera.Because the PC's aren't plot devices. And, as already explained, when they are, its just the DM saying "i want you to be involved in the plot at this point", its not a challenge to overcome[if you fail, you just have seek out the plot device] its no different from the DM inserting someone you wrote into your background into the adventure. If its no different from that, then why does it need to be codified?</blockquote>

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