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Message: <blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 4509748" data-attributes="member: 2067">This statement is incomprehensible to me. They are very much different things. That is why there are different words for them. That is why upthread there was said to be a "wall" between the two. A division between the two is the only way the OP's concept of a DM Fiat Profession or Crafting system can work (you let them do whatever makes sense as long as it doesn't affect the mechanics, and because it doesn't affect the mechanics, it doesn't really matter what they do). They are both ideas, sure. But so is Democracy, and so is a Triangle, and I would very much say that Democracy and a Triangle are, somehow, different things.But the original quote didn't talk about overlap. It talked about a division. A separation. Here it is again.That's very clearly a division. A very intense division. Upthread, the same thing was talked about: a division.Heck, let's even go into 4e rulebooks themselves.And I'm sure there are more.So unless Rechan and Yahtzee and every 4e designer are all very very mistaken on what they are talking about, it is safe to assume that, yes, there IS a difference between mechanics and story. Somehow. With regards to a Craft/Profession system, the OP suggested that because they don't affect the rules, a system where the DMs just adjudicate the results should be satisfying for everyone. The issue with that is that not everyone is happy with a system that doesn't affect the rules. The reason this is because not everyone is happy with there being a wall between mechanics and story. There is at least something of a wall there, if all the writing about 4e (including the "silo" theory) is to be believed, and I see every reason to believe that body of evidence over your own insistence that there is no difference because they are "ideas." True. If they don't carry over there is a barrier. That barrier, for me, is a bad thing. 4e has that barrier, and this is a bad thing for me.If we can agree on that, we don't have any real debate, here. No one asked you to. People do ask D&D to, but D&D doesn't, so it is still valid, because D&D hasn't done it. That's what this thread is about, after all: D&D. Not your pet house rules, but the published rules of the game. The OP suggested that DM Fiat is perfectly OK, people disagree, and that disagreement is entirely valid, regardless of how many posts with suggestions you make.</blockquote>

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