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Proposal: Fighter/mage/thief: quick and dirty concurrent multiclassing/gestalt rules
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<blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 7025793" data-attributes="member: 53980"><p>It was touched upon, but no worries. You are correct, and while it's more a side effect of the design than direct intent, it's something I am both aware of and satisfied with.</p><p></p><p>To begin with, you are overlooking a significant feature. Cantrips and spells known from EK. Sure you don't get more slots than a single-classed wizard, but you do get spells from both classes and can use them interchangeably with you full progression slots. Based on my experience playing spellcasters, you can never have enough spell options. I've played a few casters with a 20 spellcasting score and even so there were always tough choices to make when selecting spells; always a few more spells I wished I could have taken. So it's something that shouldn't be discounted because it adds significant synergy to the combination in my estimation. That, along with the 7th and 10th level EK features, provide a level of synergy that the BM/W will never have.</p><p></p><p>Frankly, I don't think casters not getting slots from both classes is much different from a Barbarian/Fighter not getting three attacks at 5th level (because Extra Attack does not stack). One of the limits placed upon spellcasters in 5e is a limited number of spell slots, and I don't believe there is good reason to remove that restriction for hybrids.</p><p></p><p>That said, it can be argued that the system does favor a combination like Barbarian/Wizard over a Cleric/Druid, since the B/W gets all features while the C/D doesn't get slots from both classes. I'm fine with that. The 5e multiclass system already allows you to make a fairly competent C/D, since by going 11/9 you get both full slot progression and 6th level spells (from one class). By comparison, IMO, an 11/9 B/W will not be as capable. Therefore my hybrid system (slightly) favors classes that the multiclass system doesn't.</p><p></p><p>That's ideal from my standpoint since my goal for the hybrid system is to give players another avenue to express their character concepts (not from an optimization standpoint but rather in the sense of effective portrayal). If a player would rather play a multiclass EK/W than a hybrid so that they don't "lose out" on slots, that's fine by me. Whatever works best for them. The point is to maintain parity between the various systems for character development (single-class, multiclass, hybrid) while preserving synergy. Based on my experience, if you have multiple classes it is more fun for the classes to be able to function synergistically than not. Without synergy, it feels more like you're playing two characters awkwardly trapped in one body. If I were to give double the slots and maintain synergy hybrids would easily overshadow multiclassed characters and potentially even single classed characters. Given the choice between the two, I'd rather have synergy which is why I went the way I did.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Fanaelialae, post: 7025793, member: 53980"] It was touched upon, but no worries. You are correct, and while it's more a side effect of the design than direct intent, it's something I am both aware of and satisfied with. To begin with, you are overlooking a significant feature. Cantrips and spells known from EK. Sure you don't get more slots than a single-classed wizard, but you do get spells from both classes and can use them interchangeably with you full progression slots. Based on my experience playing spellcasters, you can never have enough spell options. I've played a few casters with a 20 spellcasting score and even so there were always tough choices to make when selecting spells; always a few more spells I wished I could have taken. So it's something that shouldn't be discounted because it adds significant synergy to the combination in my estimation. That, along with the 7th and 10th level EK features, provide a level of synergy that the BM/W will never have. Frankly, I don't think casters not getting slots from both classes is much different from a Barbarian/Fighter not getting three attacks at 5th level (because Extra Attack does not stack). One of the limits placed upon spellcasters in 5e is a limited number of spell slots, and I don't believe there is good reason to remove that restriction for hybrids. That said, it can be argued that the system does favor a combination like Barbarian/Wizard over a Cleric/Druid, since the B/W gets all features while the C/D doesn't get slots from both classes. I'm fine with that. The 5e multiclass system already allows you to make a fairly competent C/D, since by going 11/9 you get both full slot progression and 6th level spells (from one class). By comparison, IMO, an 11/9 B/W will not be as capable. Therefore my hybrid system (slightly) favors classes that the multiclass system doesn't. That's ideal from my standpoint since my goal for the hybrid system is to give players another avenue to express their character concepts (not from an optimization standpoint but rather in the sense of effective portrayal). If a player would rather play a multiclass EK/W than a hybrid so that they don't "lose out" on slots, that's fine by me. Whatever works best for them. The point is to maintain parity between the various systems for character development (single-class, multiclass, hybrid) while preserving synergy. Based on my experience, if you have multiple classes it is more fun for the classes to be able to function synergistically than not. Without synergy, it feels more like you're playing two characters awkwardly trapped in one body. If I were to give double the slots and maintain synergy hybrids would easily overshadow multiclassed characters and potentially even single classed characters. Given the choice between the two, I'd rather have synergy which is why I went the way I did. [/QUOTE]
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Proposal: Fighter/mage/thief: quick and dirty concurrent multiclassing/gestalt rules
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