D&D 5E Proposed House Rules for Supplies

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
So, I need to call into question your "meager" supplies. You make them the lesser/least type. They Should Not Be. Human beings have been living off the land for 10,000 years just fine. Like a lot of us country folk, nearly all common folk of a typical D&D game world have to know how to live off the land. After all, your choice is find your own "supplies" or die.

So...having your natural supplies be "meager" really does not fit. The idea that only "stuff from a city" is a Standard Supply is not really fitting.

And "meager supplies" don't last long? Well....true enough as the whole idea of living off the land is you live of the land your currently on and don't really carry much with you. But I would also note that not all natural supplies "don't last long". Some of them do quite well...like plants and plant products. Tree bark is a great example.
Meager supplies have been removed from the system, the updated version is in post #18.
 

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James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
The only thing I don't like about your new system @James Gasik is the Strife system, and that's because the exact penalties feel a little too divorced from the fiction to me.
The penalties represent the fact that Supplies are not just food, they include ammunition, basic gear maintenance, and non-costly spell components. If you run out of Supplies, you start to run out of these essentials as well.
 

Stalker0

Legend
I think we have something here, but its a bit scattered. I'm going to try a rewrite where I clean it up and organize it a bit better. I'll make a few changes I think would be useful (which I will highlight).

Here's a stab at it:

Using Supplies
Instead of tracking small items like material components, ammunition, or rations, use the following rules:
  • Weight: 1 supply = 2 lbs of weight
  • Short Rest: Characters need 1 unit of Supplies for a Short Rest, which takes 10 minutes. During this time, you can do things like Use Objects, Hide, or Search. You can take only 2 Short Rests per day.
  • Long Rest: You need 2 units of Supplies for a Long Rest. You can't cast leveled Spells during a Long Rest.
  • Interruptions: If interrupted during a Rest, add 5 minutes to a Short Rest or 1 hour to a Long Rest. If, however, the interruption is longer than 10 minutes (Short Rest) or 2 hours (Long Rest), you must start the Rest again.
  • Cooking Supplies: Before consuming a supply for a short rest, a character can make an Intelligence (Cooking Utensils) check to improve the efficacy of the rest.
    • DC 1-4: The supply is ruined and cannot be consumed.
    • DC 10: Consuming the supply provides +1d4 hitpoints on the first healing surge used in the short rest.
    • DC 15+: For every 5 on the check beyond DC 10, gain an additional +1d4 hitpoints on the healing surge.
    • This benefit only works on the first healing surge used in a short rest.
Finding/Creating Supplies
  • Foraging: Make a Wisdom (Survival) check DC 10 to gather 1 supply from the environment. This takes 1 hour. Each additional roll made in the same area adds +1 DC to the check.
    • Outlander Background: You gain 2 supplies (rather than 1) with a successful check. This benefit can be used up to 5 times per day.
    • (MODIFIED): Critical Success - On a crit, at the DM's discretion the character may find special herbs, toxins, or other interesting materials. The benefit should only be applied once per area.
  • Spells: Add the following benefits for these spells to the supply system.
    • Create or Destroy Water: Grants advantage on any check made to forage.
    • Goodberry: Each berry counts as 1 supply.
    • Create Food and Water: Creates 30 supply of food and water.
Purchasing Supplies
  • Supply: Costs 5 sp
  • Exceptional Supplies: Cost 5 gp. (MODIFIED) Allows a third Short Rest after a Long Rest.
Running out of Supply
Each day without Supplies incurs a Strife level. The effects of each level are cumulative.
  • Level 1: -1 to Attack Rolls.
  • Level 2:
    • Disadvantage on ranged weapon attacks (instead of the -1 attack penalty)
    • (MODIFIED) -1 DC to spells that have a material component
  • Level 3:
    • Cannot make ranged weapon attacks.
    • Cannot cast spells with a material component.
  • Level 4: Melee weapon attacks are made with disadvantage (replacing the -1 penalty).
 

ezo

Hero
Well, I'm bowing out of this conversation. I'm sorry, I can't really see how such a system would be appealing or less tedious than simply tracking supplies as it. I get what the OP is trying to do, but for me personally this approach wouldn't work.

However, I wish you luck in trying to create something along these lines that works for you.
 

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
Stalker0: I can certainly see why modifying DC's for spells would be in general more applicable than spell attack rolls for the Strife penalty, but going from "-1 DC" straight to "can't cast spells" is a bit sudden. I'm not sure I like going from a 1 in 6 chance to find something interesting to a 1 in 20 (requiring critical success), especially since this no longer takes Natural Explorer into account. I just feel like this goes from "oh hey, I found a neat thing" every so often to once in a blue moon.

In retrospect, tracking +1/-1 penalties is likely too trivial to bother with.
 

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
The final version of the Supplies rules before play begins, for anyone interested:

Supplies-

As opposed to tracking mundane things such as rations, ammunition, or non-costly spell components, characters instead have access to Supplies.

A unit of Supplies has a value of 5 silver pieces and weighs 2 pounds. Supplies can be purchased in most communities or gathered in the field.

Use of Supplies-

Whenever a character wishes to take a Short Rest, they must consume a unit of Supplies. This includes eating, bandaging minor wounds, and performing basic maintenance on their equipment.

Change to Short Rests: characters need to have one unit of Supplies to take a Short Rest, which are consumed at the end of the Rest. The idea is that you're maybe having a quick meal or snack while you rest. A Short Rest takes 10 minutes to complete. While taking a Short Rest, characters can Use Objects, Hide, Search, or possibly use some Class Features. Other Actions may be taken with DM approval. A character can normally only take up to 2 Short Rests per day.

Whenever a character wishes to take a Long Rest, they must consume two units of Supplies. One unit is consumed at the start of the Rest, and the second at the end of the Rest.

Clarifications to Long Rests: During a Long Rest, you can take most Actions, but are unable to cast leveled Spells. You can normally only benefit from a single Long Rest in a given 24-hour period, and you cannot take 2 Long Rests back-to-back (but see Full Rests, below). Completing a Long Rest allows you recover a number of Healing Surges equal to half your total Healing Surges (round fractions up). You may spend Healing Surges to recover hit points at any point during the Long Rest period (even if your rest is interrupted). Further, you remove one level of Exhaustion and a level of Strife when the Rest ends.

Interruptions: being interrupted does not necessarily make you unable to complete a Rest. Normally, if you are forced to take Action or damage that would prevent a Rest, the time needed to complete that Rest is simply increased by 5 minutes for a Short Rest or 1 hour for a Long Rest. If, however, the interruption is longer than 10 minutes (Short Rest) or 2 hours (Long Rest), you must start the Rest all over again.

If you find, after beginning a Long Rest, that you are unable to complete the Long Rest in a timely fashion, you need not consume the second unit of Supplies and claim instead the benefits of a Long Rest.

Failure to Rest: if you fail to take a Short or Long Rest in a single 24-hour period, you gain a level of Strife (see below). If you fail to take a Long Rest in a single 24-hour period, you also gain a level of Exhaustion.

Strife-

When characters run short on Supplies, they begin to suffer additional consequences.

Strife level 1: Ammunition and reserves of spell components begin to run dry. When using weapons with the Ammunition property, you cannot score a critical hit. Spells with a non-costly Material component have a 1-in-4 chance (1 on a d4 roll) of only dealing half damage; if the spell does not deal damage, it instead fails without expending the spell slot.

Strife level 2: melee weapons begin to suffer wear and tear. Weapon attacks can no longer score a critical hit. You cannot make attacks with weapons that use the Ammunition property. Spells with a non-costly Material component have a 2-in-6 chance (1 or 2 on a d6 roll) of only dealing half damage; if the spell does not deal damage, it instead fails without expending the spell slot.

Strife level 3: armor begins to degrade, losing it's protective value. The AC bonus of Armor and Shields are reduced by 1. Weapon attacks have their damage reduced by 1d4. Spells with a non-costly Material component have a 3-in-6 chance (1, 2, or 3 on a d6 roll) of only dealing half damage; if the spell does not deal damage, it instead fails without expending the spell slot.

Strife level 4: Armor becomes useless. Weapon attacks are made with disadvantage. Spells with non-costly Material components cannot be used.


Gathering Supplies-

Supplies can be scrounged from the environment with a Wisdom (Survival) check; success grants 1 unit of Supplies. This requires 1 hour of time per check. The base DC is 10, though the player may have advantage or disadvantage depending on how plentiful the area. The DC goes up by 1 for each roll made in the same area.

Note: some features and abilities can impact the efficiency of gathering Supplies- make certain to check with your Dungeomaster!


Specialized Supplies-

Characters may find special Supplies while foraging, or occasionally available in settlements. These grant additional benefits when used. The most common form of Special Supplies are Quality Supplies.

Quality Supplies: these typically cost 5 gp and weigh 2 pounds. When a unit is consumed during a rest, the character gains the following benefits:

1- any Healing Surges spent to recover hit points during the rest add 1d4 to the amount healed.

2- there is a 1-in-4 chance (1 on a d4 roll) the character can take an additional Short Rest within the next 24 hours.

3- the character gains Inspiration.


Cooking: while Supplies consist of more than just food and drink, most species can benefit from properly prepared meals. An Intelligence check can be made before using a unit of Supplies- if the character has proficiency in Cooking Utensils, they can add their proficiency bonus to this check. With a check of less than 5, the Supplies are ruined and cannot be consumed. With a check result of 10, the first healing surge spent during this Rest adds d4 to their result. If this check is exceeded by 5, for every 5 points, add another d4 (thus a DC 30 check would provide a meal with miraculous healing benefits, adding 5d4 to the first healing surge spent!).


Other Considerations: spells can have an impact on the gathering and use of Supplies. Strife penalties might be able to be reduced with the use of magic or abilities that can repair items. Species with unusual physiology might not need as much Supplies to take Rests. Make certain to check with your Dungeonmaster if you have any questions!*

*The various things I considered like Create Water, Natural Explorer, and so on, are still written down, but I'm only going to bring them up as needed, rather than further add to my player's comprehension bloat!
 

The final version of the Supplies rules before play begins, for anyone interested:

Supplies-

As opposed to tracking mundane things such as rations, ammunition, or non-costly spell components, characters instead have access to Supplies.

A unit of Supplies has a value of 5 silver pieces and weighs 2 pounds. Supplies can be purchased in most communities or gathered in the field.

Use of Supplies-

Whenever a character wishes to take a Short Rest, they must consume a unit of Supplies. This includes eating, bandaging minor wounds, and performing basic maintenance on their equipment.

Change to Short Rests: characters need to have one unit of Supplies to take a Short Rest, which are consumed at the end of the Rest. The idea is that you're maybe having a quick meal or snack while you rest. A Short Rest takes 10 minutes to complete. While taking a Short Rest, characters can Use Objects, Hide, Search, or possibly use some Class Features. Other Actions may be taken with DM approval. A character can normally only take up to 2 Short Rests per day.

Whenever a character wishes to take a Long Rest, they must consume two units of Supplies. One unit is consumed at the start of the Rest, and the second at the end of the Rest.

Clarifications to Long Rests: During a Long Rest, you can take most Actions, but are unable to cast leveled Spells. You can normally only benefit from a single Long Rest in a given 24-hour period, and you cannot take 2 Long Rests back-to-back (but see Full Rests, below). Completing a Long Rest allows you recover a number of Healing Surges equal to half your total Healing Surges (round fractions up). You may spend Healing Surges to recover hit points at any point during the Long Rest period (even if your rest is interrupted). Further, you remove one level of Exhaustion and a level of Strife when the Rest ends.

Interruptions: being interrupted does not necessarily make you unable to complete a Rest. Normally, if you are forced to take Action or damage that would prevent a Rest, the time needed to complete that Rest is simply increased by 5 minutes for a Short Rest or 1 hour for a Long Rest. If, however, the interruption is longer than 10 minutes (Short Rest) or 2 hours (Long Rest), you must start the Rest all over again.

If you find, after beginning a Long Rest, that you are unable to complete the Long Rest in a timely fashion, you need not consume the second unit of Supplies and claim instead the benefits of a Long Rest.

Failure to Rest: if you fail to take a Short or Long Rest in a single 24-hour period, you gain a level of Strife (see below). If you fail to take a Long Rest in a single 24-hour period, you also gain a level of Exhaustion.

Strife-

When characters run short on Supplies, they begin to suffer additional consequences.

Strife level 1: Ammunition and reserves of spell components begin to run dry. When using weapons with the Ammunition property, you cannot score a critical hit. Spells with a non-costly Material component have a 1-in-4 chance (1 on a d4 roll) of only dealing half damage; if the spell does not deal damage, it instead fails without expending the spell slot.

Strife level 2: melee weapons begin to suffer wear and tear. Weapon attacks can no longer score a critical hit. You cannot make attacks with weapons that use the Ammunition property. Spells with a non-costly Material component have a 2-in-6 chance (1 or 2 on a d6 roll) of only dealing half damage; if the spell does not deal damage, it instead fails without expending the spell slot.

Strife level 3: armor begins to degrade, losing it's protective value. The AC bonus of Armor and Shields are reduced by 1. Weapon attacks have their damage reduced by 1d4. Spells with a non-costly Material component have a 3-in-6 chance (1, 2, or 3 on a d6 roll) of only dealing half damage; if the spell does not deal damage, it instead fails without expending the spell slot.

Strife level 4: Armor becomes useless. Weapon attacks are made with disadvantage. Spells with non-costly Material components cannot be used.


Gathering Supplies-

Supplies can be scrounged from the environment with a Wisdom (Survival) check; success grants 1 unit of Supplies. This requires 1 hour of time per check. The base DC is 10, though the player may have advantage or disadvantage depending on how plentiful the area. The DC goes up by 1 for each roll made in the same area.

Note: some features and abilities can impact the efficiency of gathering Supplies- make certain to check with your Dungeomaster!


Specialized Supplies-

Characters may find special Supplies while foraging, or occasionally available in settlements. These grant additional benefits when used. The most common form of Special Supplies are Quality Supplies.

Quality Supplies: these typically cost 5 gp and weigh 2 pounds. When a unit is consumed during a rest, the character gains the following benefits:

1- any Healing Surges spent to recover hit points during the rest add 1d4 to the amount healed.

2- there is a 1-in-4 chance (1 on a d4 roll) the character can take an additional Short Rest within the next 24 hours.

3- the character gains Inspiration.


Cooking: while Supplies consist of more than just food and drink, most species can benefit from properly prepared meals. An Intelligence check can be made before using a unit of Supplies- if the character has proficiency in Cooking Utensils, they can add their proficiency bonus to this check. With a check of less than 5, the Supplies are ruined and cannot be consumed. With a check result of 10, the first healing surge spent during this Rest adds d4 to their result. If this check is exceeded by 5, for every 5 points, add another d4 (thus a DC 30 check would provide a meal with miraculous healing benefits, adding 5d4 to the first healing surge spent!).


Other Considerations: spells can have an impact on the gathering and use of Supplies. Strife penalties might be able to be reduced with the use of magic or abilities that can repair items. Species with unusual physiology might not need as much Supplies to take Rests. Make certain to check with your Dungeonmaster if you have any questions!*

*The various things I considered like Create Water, Natural Explorer, and so on, are still written down, but I'm only going to bring them up as needed, rather than further add to my player's comprehension bloat!
I like everything other then some of the Strife Levels and the fact that the second kind of Specialized Supplies is only a chance of an additional short rest (I'd rather it just grant the short rest; it feels like a waste of time to have a chance to find something that is just another chance to find something).

For the Strife Levels, I don't like the ammunition penalty or the spell failure penalty, and its because they don't make sense with the fiction. If I'm running low on arrows, that shouldn't stop me from hitting a critical hit. If anything, it should be like "Roll 1d6; you can make that number of attacks with your ranged weapon before running out of ammunition. When you lose this level of strife, you find or create more ammunition."

As for the spell penalties, what does having components run dry matter if I'm using a focus? I think it'd be better if "When you cast a spell that requires material components, roll 1d4. On a 1, you can no longer cast that spell until you lose this level of strife." This IMO would be cleaner and, for foci, you could frame it as the focus itself is being damaged, much like weapons and armor.

I like the weapons losing their ability to critical hit btw, just not the ranged ones because it really just makes no sense at all vs the fiction.
 

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
I like everything other then some of the Strife Levels and the fact that the second kind of Specialized Supplies is only a chance of an additional short rest (I'd rather it just grant the short rest; it feels like a waste of time to have a chance to find something that is just another chance to find something).

For the Strife Levels, I don't like the ammunition penalty or the spell failure penalty, and its because they don't make sense with the fiction. If I'm running low on arrows, that shouldn't stop me from hitting a critical hit. If anything, it should be like "Roll 1d6; you can make that number of attacks with your ranged weapon before running out of ammunition. When you lose this level of strife, you find or create more ammunition."

As for the spell penalties, what does having components run dry matter if I'm using a focus? I think it'd be better if "When you cast a spell that requires material components, roll 1d4. On a 1, you can no longer cast that spell until you lose this level of strife." This IMO would be cleaner and, for foci, you could frame it as the focus itself is being damaged, much like weapons and armor.

I like the weapons losing their ability to critical hit btw, just not the ranged ones because it really just makes no sense at all vs the fiction.
Remember that by the rules, you can reclaim an amount of ammunition after each encounter. I think it's perfectly reasonable that a fired arrow might suffer a little damage, thus relegating some to the "well, if I really need to use one" category. I was also inspired by how you could use actual sling bullets or just rocks you pick up off the ground with a sling (back in the day at least), which had an impact (no pun intended) on their viability.

Kind of the point of this exercise is that I do want to have the fiction of needing to gather material components in the game again. Obviously, the existence of focuses other than the spell component pouch needs to be addressed- if you can just carry a stick around and not need to worry about components, then Strife would never affect your spellcasting.

As to making you unable to use a specific spell, it's true, that would be more logical, but here I'm worried about spellcasters with limited spells known, like Sorcerers, who don't need to be crippled more than they are. There's a school of thought that says Sorcerers shouldn't need to dabble with material components, as their magic is more innate, but for now, I want to try this with all casters on even footing.

What I presume happens as Supplies dwindle is that casters become more frugal with their components, trying to make do with the bare minimum to cast their spells, and that has it's own problems.

At any rate, thanks for the feedback! I'll post when I have some results from actual play!
 

James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
Ok, thinking about what you said, Shardstone, I've simply added this note to the rules packet.

NOTE: at this point, spellcasters may be wondering about spell foci. If you use a wand or a holy symbol, why would you care about materialcomponents? With these rules, focuses are expendable- they aren't asubstitute for material components, but a different system ofachieving the same end goal. A holy symbol is imbued with divineenergy which can be depleted- perhaps you need to maintain it withholy oils or special incense. Channeling arcane power through a wandcan cause it to splinter and crack over time.

The advantage of focuses is however, two-fold. One, you don't need to manually come into contact with dung or other unsavory materials. Two, the existence of special or enchanted focuses is a real possibility in the campaign!
 

Lanefan

Victoria Rules
I think you're being a bit too generous on interruptions to long rests. Were it me, I'd say a half-hour interruption means you're starting over.

I also wonder if there's space here to break supplies into two categories: edibles and other. This would allow the system you have to work for food and water (which on first glance it does quite well) but also allow you to say that foraging doesn't resupply things like ammunition and perhaps-esoteric spell components. As written right now, it implies the PCs can - if they look - find crossbow bolts and spell components and bowstrings just lying around in any unexplored wilderness hex, which seems a bit odd somehow.
 

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