D&D 3E/3.5 Protecting the Wizard before 3e

[Rechan]

3e introduced Attacks of Opportunity. So something could not run past someone without being punished for it.

Before AoOs, how did "being behind the fighter" protect the wizard at all?

If there were no mechanics to prevent an enemy from running past you to the "back rank", how did who was standing in the doorway matter? Or even where you were standing.

 

[kitcik]

3e introduced Attacks of Opportunity. So something could not run past someone without being punished for it.

Before AoOs, how did "being behind the fighter" protect the wizard at all?

If there were no mechanics to prevent an enemy from running past you to the "back rank", how did who was standing in the doorway matter? Or even where you were standing.

Nothing to stop "running past" but you could not "run through." If you had a sufficiently wide battle line (which could be one if in a doorway), the wizard in the back could not be reached.

 

[Rechan]

Nothing to stop "running past" but you could not "run through." If you had a sufficiently wide battle line (which could be one if in a doorway), the wizard in the back could not be reached.

Yeah but how would you determine that? For instance, couldn't an ogre just plow through linebacker style?

Basically, were there rules or was it more of a gentleman's agreement that no one could get past the guy in the way.

 

[Swedish Chef]

We house ruled in AoOs way back in 1st edition. Basically, if you ran past an opponent and were forced by terrain to do it within their reach, they could attack you. It wasn't based on physical reach according to the rules, but more on common sense. IE the 20ft tall Giant could hit you if you ran by him within 10 feet, but the human fighter could only hit you if you ran by him within 5 feet. It really only came in play in enclosed places, as we assumed that the opponent took all due caution to move around you in a wide open area.

Many a mage was back stabbed by sneaky thieves.

 

[kitcik]

Yeah but how would you determine that? For instance, couldn't an ogre just plow through linebacker style?

Basically, were there rules or was it more of a gentleman's agreement that no one could get past the guy in the way.

1E was 25% rules and 75% DM's call / gentlemen's agreement.

The grapple rules were a mess and there was no "bull rush" or "overrrun."

There was nothing stating the ogre could do that, so by default he couldn't - subject to DM's call / a different agreement.

 

[Alzrius]

I think a lot of this was also based around the idea that the guy in the middle of melee hacking at opponents was something that said opponents had to pay attention to, and so couldn't focus on the wizard.

 

[Crothian]

Why would the ogre go attack the Wizard? Most of the time the Wizard was just back through throwing daggers that rarely came close to hitting. In the early editions the fighters were the ones needing to be attacked because they could attack all day. Even at high levels the wizard and clerics had to prepare spells and it was rare that they ever got the right spells they needing.

 

[kitcik]

Why would the ogre go attack the Wizard? Most of the time the Wizard was just back through throwing daggers that rarely came close to hitting. In the early editions the fighters were the ones needing to be attacked because they could attack all day. Even at high levels the wizard and clerics had to prepare spells and it was rare that they ever got the right spells they needing.

You had me 'til that last sentence.

Tell that to Vashalla, my 33rd level (4 years of 4x / week play) 1E cleric. She always seemed to have the right spells.

 

[trancejeremy]

Well, bear in mind, in all the pre-3e games I played in, we didn't use miniatures, really. (Okay we usually had them, but just used them for marching order and to help visualize what our guys looked like)

So positioning was pretty much all narrative, not done on a grid or anything.

With that said, strictly speaking, 3e didn't introduce attacks of opportunity. In 1st ed AD&D anyway (which is what I've mostly played, probably 60% that/30% BECMI/10% 3e) you would get a free attack if someone disengaged from you in melee. (That was for fleeing though)

And in the DMG, it did indicate that when spellcasters would try to start casting a spell, opponents would try to hit them to interupt.

But again, you couldn't just plow through people.

I mean, really, is a 500 lb ogre really going to be able to bull rush through 2-3 200+lb warriors with heavy armor and very pointy weapons? And why wouldn't the mage be running away from said ogre?

 

[Starbuck_II]

With that said, strictly speaking, 3e didn't introduce attacks of opportunity. In 1st ed AD&D anyway (which is what I've mostly played, probably 60% that/30% BECMI/10% 3e) you would get a free attack if someone disengaged from you in melee. (That was for fleeing though)

2E as well had AoO from disengaging.
Plus, even if he tried, you can't target attacks if there are more than 1 with ranged and I think 2 with melee (mas combat rules, not really mass but that is what they called them).
So two warriors by a Mage meant he had a 1/3rd chance of being targeted.
Not everyone remembered those targeting rules but there were there.