Question about Supernatural abilities

[green slime]

Does the use of a (su) ability give a display or visual clue as to whom is using it? There is no (V,S,M) components. Its not spell-like. So how does anyone know who the source of an (su) effect is?

Would/should a hexblade be revealed as such when he uses his curse?

Does the use of a fundamental reveal a shadowcaster as the source?

Or are (su) abilities so second nature that the effect just occurs, and it is up to those present to guess the source of the effect? (Assuming a massive melee battle going on)

 

[Drowbane]

Hmm, never really thought about this. Good question!

IME, it has always been assumed that (Su) have some sort of v, s, and/or m component. Hexblades verbally curse thier victims, Balors gesture and fire bursts forth, etc.

One major exception that I can think of are (Su) abilties based on psionics (IME, nobody uses psionic displays for powers... its the Invisible Art for a reason).

 

[Starbuck_II]

One major exception that I can think of are (Su) abilties based on psionics (IME, nobody uses psionic displays for powers... its the Invisible Art for a reason).

You are supposed to use Displays. That is why they get the Concentration skill: to hide their displays.

 

[frankthedm]

IIRC a few folks argued that [su] are pretty much undetectable, notably in a thread on players using Reserve Feats stealthily.

 

[green slime]

IIRC a few folks argued that [su] are pretty much undetectable, notably in a thread on players using Reserve Feats stealthily.

It does seem to be completely unmentioned in the rules. How strange.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

IME, it has always been assumed that (Su) have some sort of v, s, and/or m component. Hexblades verbally curse thier victims, Balors gesture and fire bursts forth, etc.

What components a Su has depends on the particular Su in question. Draconic Breath (from the Draconic Heritage feat tree) has no components.

So, whether others perceive the Su user as using an Su depends on the Su in question, based largely on common sense.

After all, if my PC uses his Draconic Heritage Breath Weapon to funnel an arcane spell into...well...a breath weapon...it should be pretty darn obvious who is doing what. At least in the sense of "that guy there is breathing lightning at us!"

OTOH, someone who is using a reserve feat to coat his weapon with a sheen of force energy might not be obvious at all, and one might reasonably assume that even if the effect is noticed, it would be a property of the weapon and not the caster using an ability- leading that person to think that disarming/sundering the weapon takes care of the problem.

BTW, frankthedm...got a link to that thread?

 

[green slime]

What components a Su has depends on the particular Su in question. Draconic Breath (from the Draconic Heritage feat tree) has no components.

So, whether others perceive the Su user as using an Su depends on the Su in question, based largely on common sense.

After all, if my PC uses his Draconic Heritage Breath Weapon to funnel an arcane spell into...well...a breath weapon...it should be pretty darn obvious who is doing what. At least in the sense of "that guy there is breathing lightning at us!"

OTOH, someone who is using a reserve feat to coat his weapon with a sheen of force energy might not be obvious at all, and one might reasonably assume that even if the effect is noticed, it would be a property of the weapon and not the caster using an ability- leading that person to think that disarming/sundering the weapon takes care of the problem.

BTW, frankthedm...got a link to that thread?

Well the Breath Weapon is stating the obvious. The question remains though, whether the use of the reserve feat (which is, in most cases, a standard action after all) has some sort of "activation display" or whether it can be done completely covertly.

Using a breath weapon may be obvious, one can imagine its effects and displays, but invoking a fundamental mystery? Is the hexblade required to vocally cuss at the target, or is it a mere angry glare, or perhaps not even a bored shrug?

Psions can attempt to hide their displays, and the rule for that is clearly stated, but nothing is mentioned for reserve feats, or mysteries, or...

 

[Runestar]

Just curious, does it state anywhere that SU abilities do not have verbal/somatic displays, or require xp? I always thought that was the case, yet I can't seem to find a source for said rule.

If so, this can mean that while you could have a dragon visibly inhale in preparation to make a breath attack, it would not have to by RAW (eg: it could continue to breath despite being disabled, such as having its dex reduced to zero), if you don't have to actually move to use a SU ability.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Runestar
Just curious, does it state anywhere that SU abilities do not have verbal/somatic displays, or require xp? I always thought that was the case, yet I can't seem to find a source for said rule.

You're probably thinking of...

SRD
Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A few spell-like abilities are unique; these are explained in the text where they are described.

A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus or have an XP cost.

and if you're like most people, you extend that by implication to Supernatural Abilities.

SRD
Supernatural abilities are magical and go away in an antimagic field but are not subject to spell resistance, counterspells, or to being dispelled by dispel magic. Using a supernatural ability is a standard action unless noted otherwise. Supernatural abilities may have a use limit or be usable at will, just like spell-like abilities. However, supernatural abilities do not provoke attacks of opportunity and never require Concentration checks. Unless otherwise noted, a supernatural ability has an effective caster level equal to the creature’s Hit Dice.

That said, as I recall, the BW explicitly states that it has no components.

As for breath weapons in particular...

SRD
Creatures unable to breathe can still use breath weapons. (The term is something of a misnomer.)