Question reegarding Craft (Armorsmithing) & Starting equipment

[Spatzimaus]

When actually creating a higher-level character from scratch, though, you have more freedom.

My DM wanted to make a side campaign that started at 14th level. So, I made a 13th-level Psion that had spent the extra 14,000 XP making items and selling them (14,000 XP means market price of 350,000 GP, material cost half, so I made a profit of 175 kgp which added to the 110 or so you'd get for level 14). While I was a level below the rest in spellcasting, I had great items and a lot of spare cash. Before you scream "MUNCHKIN!!!": my first level was Aristocrat (yes, NPC class), I had Leadership to represent the merchant organization I was part of, and the last couple levels were of a custom 5-level PrC with very little spellcasting but a lot of Craft and item creation bonuses. The Wizard in the group handled raw power, I was more like the swiss army knife.

Now, having played something like that, I'd say to be VERY careful using money or equipment to balance a level difference. Equipment comes and goes; it can be stolen, it can be broken, or it could just not be at hand when the fighting starts. If the DM uses circumstances like that, the player feels unfairly targetted (it'd be like being a Wizard in a campaign where most fights take place in anti-magic fields). If he doesn't do stuff like that, though, many encounters become trivial. A few well-chosen 50-charge wands or utility items go a LONG way. Fill a Heward's Haversack with every cheap magic item in the game, then see how often they're useful.

 

[Jdvn1]

Do you allow the same "reward" for a character's investment in kleptomaniacal tendencies?

Or even a character who maxes out Perform. It's really easy and legal to make lots of money in bars.

 

[Sledge]

Yes I'd let a "thief" with the appropriate skills buy himself full plate.
Seriously what's the big deal with a little extra gold worth of equipment. Nothing magical, maybe a masterwork weapon or such. No big deal. That said the player of the "thief" would have to actually ask for such a benefit.

 

[genshou]

Yes I'd let a "thief" with the appropriate skills buy himself full plate.
Seriously what's the big deal with a little extra gold worth of equipment. Nothing magical, maybe a masterwork weapon or such. No big deal. That said the player of the "thief" would have to actually ask for such a benefit.

Personally I wouldn't allow it, since it's sort of assumed that's where quite a bit of the rogue's gear comes from. And let's see you try to sneak out of a smithy with a suit of armor! I only suggested that to point out that a rogue doesn't get to use their skills (which they CHOOSE to take; they are not a class ability) to get more swag at 1st-level.

Honestly, I'd allow a character to use the Craft skill pre-campaign with one restriction: they have to pay for the raw materials and THEN start making checks. For every week they invest in making the item, they have to pay various expenses and also lose out on other opportunities in character class training and the like, and therefore lose 2 gp in total starting equipment value per week spent crafting. Additionally, they may ruin the raw materials and have to start again, paying half the raw material cost again. Not the option anyone but a skilled craftsman would pursue at 1st-level.

 

[Nim]

I'd say as long as the crafting DC can be reached by the character (assuming he took 20) and he has the costs for the raw materials...

Would have to Take 10, not 20. There's a potential consequence to failing a craft check (in the form of lost materials).

 

[Crothian]

Ya, I'd let it. I like people to use craft and it won';t be that big if a bonus in the long run.

 

[Sigurd]

I'd allow it

Craft has less risk than stealing stuff. It is not unreasonable to think that whoever taught the char to make armor helped him make, or gave him, a suit of armor to begin adventuring with.

Further the player has certainly paid for the armor. Aside from the question of whether this falls into the small stuff you shouldnt worry about, 4 skill points should give the char some advantage. At later levels will another member of your party resent the armor this char made or will they value the freedom of placing skill points elsewhere?

You might represent a risk of failure with a craft skill check. I wouldnt.

The arguement that thieving could do the same thing is flawed because stealing more equipment would mean an earlier beginning to the thief's career than 1st level. That would require role play and a possibility of terrible failure.

I sometimes let Wizards start with their intelligence bonus in 1st level scrolls so long as they draw from their own spell book. Unless players instantly sell these helping hands I don think its an abuse.

If other players object, let them do it as well. I dont think it hurts game balance much.

Sigurd



Besides, this way the DM can look at the char after a string of bad luck and say....

'Maybe its your armor?'

 

[Lord Wyrm]

I've let characters use craft to make armor in the past, but by the same token folks with Profession, Perform, or Knowledge skills were allowed checks to start with a little extra. Course I get real mean on characters without one of those four skills. (you can't adventure all the time)

 

[Sledge]

Okay I'm shocked that no one noticed. I said I'd let an actual theif with the appropriate skills buy plate armour... so who is going to wear it? The thief? Doubtful.
I definitely would NOT require the character to start late because of this activity either. If eberron can let the "forged" start with adamantine, or is it mithral, then a regular character can safely get a few hundred coins based on the skill investments.

 

[genshou]

You might represent a risk of failure with a craft skill check. I wouldnt.

Why not? It's entirely appropriate that they run the same risk before-game that they would in-game of ruining raw materials. Otherwise, you're actively encouraging metagaming.