Races and Classes cover on Amazon!

[vagabundo]

I would like to add my support for the books. I'm really stoked for 4e.

If I wasn't so cash strapped at the moment I'd bite (mortgage, wife in college).

But one point, even if you were thinking of downloading on p2p, it is very rude to mention it on a forum that you know the designer visit. It is just very bad form.

 

[Oldtimer]

He suggested piracy, which is stealing. And honestly, I'm shocked the mods haven't nixed discussion of such illegal activities.

Now, if you want to go over to a friend's house or look at it in a store, fine. If you want to discuss it on the boards, fine. But let's not call what Aldrac suggested as something other than what it is.

I made the suggestion earlier that we refrained from debating piracy and concentrate on the actual thread issue. The mods seemed to agree with that. Despite that, people keep on ranting about this, so I'll just say this:

Illegal copying is not stealing. It is an infringement of a monopoly. Unless people stop comparing it to stealing, this thread will go down in a flame war, get locked and cause bans. Can we please stop using ENWorld for this debate? Pretty please?

 

[Andor]

*sigh*

You know, people are complaining and whining because they feel like WotC is making them victims of sorts. The preview books are just a way to make revenue during the interim and to generate interest in 4th edition.

Nobody is a victim here. We are consumers. WotC is a business. They come up with a model on how to run their business. As consumers, we can agree or disagree with their business model. As consumers, we can either support them or use our money elsewhere. Vote with the dollar.

Uh... What we're doing is trying to support WotC actually. If the vast bulk of your consumers tell you something is a bad idea as written that's helpfull data, not an attack. Once the book is printed, if nobody buys it WotC takes a loss and Scott loses his revenue incentive, if feedback before printing begins alters the product into something saleable then WotC does not take a loss. Learn to think people.

 

[I'm A Banana]

nuthin' to see here

 

[Reaper Steve]

PIRATING IS NOT STEALING. IT IS COPYRIGHT INFRINGEMENT

That may be the area of the law that covers it*, but taking something that does not belong to you is stealing. That's what pirates did, hence the term.


(*I think copyright infringement is when someone illegally reproduces another protected items and sells them.)

 

[Dragonhelm]

I don't think majority of the negative posts are saying WotC is victimizing them, I think your giving in to a little hyperbole here. I think if anything most people are simply asking...why would I want these books. As potential consumers I don't see that as complaining or whinnig.

Sorry, it just seemed like there was a lot of negativity. I've seen too much of it where 4e is concerned. Maybe I misinterpreted things.

At any rate I don't think it can be so easily dimissed as "people would rather be a victim than a consumer" just because they are hesitant about jumping on the bandwagon of these particular products.

Perhaps "victim" was too strong of a word, and these boards have my apologies for using it.

I would even go farther and say that a resposible consumer will seek out why they would want to purchase a product before laying their money down.

As well as they should. It wasn't my intent to suggest otherwise. In my mind, I guess I saw a lot of people asking, "Why should I bother?" without even looking at the book first. Don't buy sight unseen, but don't dismiss the book sight unseen either.

I considered buying the Rules Compendium recently, but after looking it over and seeing the online previews, I since changed my mind.

Your post above is really dismisive and, if it had been the answer given by a WotC representative (it would have, at least to me) been a tad offensive. Basically boilng it down to buy what we give you or don't, but you have no right to ask for a reason why you should buy it.

That wasn't my intent, and I apologize if I came off as dismissive. I dunno, I guess I see a lot of people who feel that WotC is "forcing" something on them. Or maybe I feel that some of the discussion could be phrased differently (as if I have any room to talk at this point).

Also, apologies if any of my comments on pirating added to derailing the thread. It's just a sore spot with me, being a designer myself.

 

[Aldarc]

Since apparently I have derailed the entire topic, I will just say this: I do not always have the luxury of just flipping through the pages at a bookstore. So if I download something and I like it, I will buy it, because by doing so it lets the developers know that this is the sort of product that I prefer. If I download it and I do not like it, then I will delete it. I never download something that I like and then not buy it, whether it be through a hardcopy or an e-book purchase.

 

[Piratecat]

Perhaps people missed post #55, where Henry asked people not to hijack the thread into a piracy discussion. Since he's not around and I am, I'll reiterate: stop discussing piracy. It's something we don't tolerate or endorse here, and there's no reason to distract the thread to discuss it.

If you just posted something regarding piracy and then read this post after-the-fact, please go edit your post.

Back on topic! I'm curious to hear more about the book, and how (if?) it will prove useful to own after the core books are out.

 

[Aldarc]

Back on topic! I'm curious to hear more about the book, and how (if?) it will prove useful to own after the core books are out.

I would say now that this is the question that this product is presenting. It sounds great to have for a period of 5 months, and then afterwards the product may be worthless. So why buy it when one will have to buy the same content again?

What I would like to see in the book would be more explanation of intent in design. Why did the developers decide to design a class like they did? Why include these races? What was the feedback that they received that shaped the content?

 

[JoeGKushner]

I what to know what material is actually exclusive and will retain value once the actual game books are out.