rage spells vs opponents

[Theo R Cwithin]

True, and breaking line of sight breaks the spell.
I was comparing it to Rage, which is 3rd level... but has multiple targets.

So, Dandu, you're probably right: it's probably not as bad as I was thinking.

 

[frankthedm]

Allows a will save. Not really overpowered.

Just because it allows a save does not mean it is not overpowered.

 

[Dandu]

Ok, then let's analyze what it does.

Cast on Melee: Melee still tries to kill you. No difference
Cast on Caster: Caster is useless on a failed save. (Note: Casters are the ones with good will saves)

Compare to other will save spells of the same level:

Hideous Laughter:
Cast on Melee: Melee is useless on a failed save.
Cast on Caster: Caster is Useless on a failed save.

Glitterdust:
Same as above. Note: affects multiple targets.

Pyrotechnics:
Same as above. Note: affects multiple targets.

If anything, Mindless Rage is weaker than other will save spells because it only works on casters while the other spells work on everyone.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Ok, then let's analyze what it does.

Cast on Melee: Melee still tries to kill you. No difference
Cast on Master: Caster is useless on a failed save. (Note: Casters are the ones with good will saves)

Compare to other will save spells of the same level:

Hideous Laughter:
Cast on Melee: Melee is useless on a failed save.
Cast on Caster: Caster is Useless on a failed save.

Glitterdust:
Same as above. Note: affects multiple targets.

Pyrotechnics:
Same as above. Note: affects multiple targets.

If anything, Mindless Rage is weaker than other will save spells because it only works on casters while the other spells work on everyone.

Basically agree. Note Glitterdust is an area spell AND allows no SR. It makes people a little less useless than Tasha's or Mindless Rage (on non-melee'ers), so it balances with them. Tasha's makes absolutely everyone useless, but has a save penalty.

So yeah, all in all, Mindless Rage is only broken if you consider those other spells broken. Which is fine if you do, just don't unfairly single out only Mindless Rage as needing a nerf.

 

[Starbuck_II]

Ok, then let's analyze what it does.

Cast on Melee: Melee still tries to kill you. No difference
Cast on Master: Caster is useless on a failed save. (Note: Casters are the ones with good will saves)

The affected creature cannot use any spells, spell-like or supernatural abilities, or ranged weapons while attacking the caster. The subject's only thoughts are of killing the caster -- if not with bare hands, then with a hand-held melee weapon at best.

It attacks you in melee. Cast it on the archer and he has to attack you in melee. This stops Warlocks from eldrich blasting you: they must use melee weapon/unarmed. This

 

[Dandu]

Archers generally seem to have good BAB, and Warlocks have 3/4th BAB. They also seem to carry melee weapons from what I can tell, if only because opponents will get into melee with them occasionally.

It's better than them shooting at you, but still worse than having them blinded or otherwise incapacitated.

 

[coyote6]

And if the warlock has hideous blow, you could be in for a small amount of pain.

OTOH, any time you can dictate what an opponent does, it's handy. My fighter spent a whole fight confused last weekend, and even though I got to beat on a bad guy the whole time (at least until I dropped), the fact that all I could do was hit him really hurt. I couldn't fall back to quaff a potion, or try to maneuver to clear space for the rest of the party, or anything.