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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Jacob Lewis" data-source="post: 9643945" data-attributes="member: 6667921">Roles are expressed as ideas, interpretations of their expected behaviors and tactics. This is translated into game mechanics, which provides rules as identities and play patterns to reinforce the narrative. In other words, Defenders mark targets so enemies focus fire on them, Controllers move them around the board and spread damage over multiple targets, etc. These have become so ingrained in the DNA of 4e design, most never think about their implications and just accepted things the way they are.What does 'defender' even mean in the context of a D&D system? Or 'controller'? They wanted something familiar that WoW players could relate to and resonate with, while trying not to tip their hand so DnD players could see what they're up to. And this little dance of pretending not to do what people saw they were doing so they wouldn't offend the people who would be offended regardless just prevented them from doing anything better than what we got.You want to know what a defender does? Well, you need to figure out what you want it to do. Don't just conceptualize it with an image or an example. Define it for all classes, not just one class. A martial defender should be different than a divine defender, and so on. But they should also share a common denominator. In this case, their role.A defender holds the line, disrupts enemy advances, and shields allies through position and resilience. Masters of defensive tactics and battlefield control. Uses shields, armor, and calculated strikes to dictate the pace of combat. Punishes enemies for ignoring them or attempting to move past.How can that be expressed in game mechanics and play? Some of that already exists and is implemented because it makes sense. Beyond that, it's just 'marks' with different affects. If it marks, its a defender. If its a defender, it can mark. That becomes the defining feature for all of them. It works. But is it the best way? The only way?Here is something I worked on for Martial Defenders:The Vanguard is a battlefield protector who holds the line, controls enemy movements, and shields allies through resilience and tactical positioning. Unlike other Warriors, the Vanguard focuses on denial, control, and endurance to dictate combat flow and absorb pressure from enemies.I reinforced their identity in game play by emphasizing them as REACTIVE classes; most of their main abilities and best results occur on the enemies turn. Their turn is spent positioning and setting themselves up to play defensive, even when they go on the offense.The Bulwark and Juggernaut provide two distinct styles of defensive play; one resilient and protective, the other aggressive and punishing.1) BulwarkWeapons: Shields, one-handed weapons, heavy armor.Tactics: Uses sheer resilience to block, deflect, and absorb damage.Features<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Zone of Protection: Allies gain defensive bonuses when adjacent.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Reactive Defense: Punishes enemies for bypassing the frontline.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Immovable Wall: Prevents forced movement and disruption.</li> </ul>2) JuggernautWeapons: Heavy weapons, two-handed weapons, medium-heavy armor.Tactics: Uses overwhelming force and relentless pressure to keep enemies engaged.Features<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Punishing Blows: Retaliates with powerful counterattacks when struck.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Forced Engagement: Locks down enemies through overwhelming presence.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Brutal Momentum: Converts defensive positioning into aggressive battlefield pressure.</li> </ul>And here's what a Martial Controller might look like.The Harrier is a relentless skirmisher who dictates the flow of battle through speed, reach, and battlefield manipulation. Unlike other warriors, the Harrier controls enemy movement, cuts off escape routes, and forces engagements on their terms.The Bladedancer and Viper provide two distinct control styles; one fluid and sweeping, the other precise and restrictive.1) BladedancerWeapons: Polearms, spears, long-reaching melee weapons.Tactics: Controls the battlefield through fluid, sweeping attacks and zone control.Features<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Sweeping Strike: Targets multiple enemies in range, disrupting formations.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Defensive Dance: Gains defensive bonuses when enemies attempt to engage.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Momentum Flow: Uses movement to enhance offensive and defensive positioning.</li> </ul>2) ViperWeapons: Whips, nets, chain weapons.Tactics: Controls single targets through ensnaring, tripping, and dragging maneuvers.Features<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Entangling Strike: Restricts enemy movement and reactions.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Whiplash: Pulls or pushes enemies into compromised positions.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Punishing Lure: Counterattacks or applies debuffs when enemies resist control effects.</li> </ul>Obviously, this doesn't fit into the 4e framework easily, especially if someone is trying to keep everything intact the way it is. But that was never my goal. 4e had a lot of great ideas and innovations, but ultimately held back by its own self-imposed limits and boundaries. I don't want a system revival or revision. I want a system that resonates with the best ideas, and then take it further to be something even better.</blockquote>

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