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Message: <blockquote data-quote="CreamCloud0" data-source="post: 9266898" data-attributes="member: 7034710">it's not just about sneak attack though, i don't consider sneak attack, or maneuvres, or rage, or scalling unarmed attacks and enhanced mobility comparable to features on the level of metamagic or invocations, i consider them on the level of spell lists, if caster ability distribution was the same way martial ones were no two spellcasters would be able to share any spell on their spell list because they'd be 'infringing on each other's thematic identity', oh no you can't give sorcerer fireball, fireball is a keystone of defining the wizard's thematic identity! and cleric is the healer class, that means no-one else can have cure wounds, that's the way i feel martial abilities are treated.just because if you shared class abilities throughout the martial group that doesn't mean they'd loose their specialisations or identity, they still have a ton of other class features to shape their identity, and the amount and kinds of access they'd get to each of the traits would also inform their identities, if you give rogue and barbarian fighter maneuvres rogue is going to get ones like precision attack or riposte and barbarian goading attack and menacing attack, but that doesn't weaken the fighter's identity.</blockquote>