re: No 4E for Necromancer Games!

[CharlesRyan]

Point of Order: WoTC's lawyers, if they are like any other corporate lawyers that I know, have absolutely nothing to do with the policy (read: business) decision behind the GSL. It is the business leaders at WoTC who said, "Hey, Mr./Ms. Attorney, draft up a license agreement that does the following N number of things." Corporate lawyer, "You got it chief."

Holy crap! A cogent, informed discussion of how business works! On the internet! And it even involves lawyers!

Next thing you know, someone is going to start talking about how "suits" and "bean-counters" are real people, who sometimes even take consumer interests and long-term customer support of a brand into consideration when making decisions. . . .

 

[Scribble]

Holy crap! A cogent, informed discussion of how business works! On the internet! And it even involves lawyers!

We've taken the nessesary steps to eliminate this problem as quickly as possible.

We appologize for any inconvenience, and would like to assure you that it will not happen again.

 

[Fifth Element]

Clark/Orcus is probably the last remaining hope to have the GSL amended to benefit the entire D&D-based hobby. Good thing he's a tenacious, and has the best interests of the hobby in mind.

Funny. I thought his decision not to use the GSL was a business decision. Not trying to cast dispersions on him, but I suspect the reasons for his actions have more to do with Necromancer Games than the hobby as a whole. Which is what I would do if I were in his situation.

 

[jmucchiello]

Next thing you know, someone is going to start talking about how "suits" and "bean-counters" are real people, who sometimes even take consumer interests and long-term customer support of a brand into consideration when making decisions. . . .

Let's not be silly here.

 

[Keefe the Thief]

Holy crap! A cogent, informed discussion of how business works! On the internet! And it even involves lawyers!

Next thing you know, someone is going to start talking about how "suits" and "bean-counters" are real people, who sometimes even take consumer interests and long-term customer support of a brand into consideration when making decisions. . . .

No sir, you have that backwards. The real decisions at Wotc are always made by a) soulless human chaff with no design experience or b) shade-wearing lawyers that look like the guy from Half-Life 2 or c) Ha$borg executives with cyberarms. I read that on a webcomic i trust, which clearly is a better source of information than your humble opinion.

 

[Brown Jenkin]

No sir, you have that backwards. The real decisions at Wotc are always made by a) soulless human chaff with no design experience or b) shade-wearing lawyers that look like the guy from Half-Life 2 or c) Ha executives with cyberarms. I read that on a webcomic i trust, which clearly is a better source of information than your humble opinion.

You forgot d) An alien brain in a jar. The real problem was that someone made the mistake of revealing that fact with the Gleemax problem.

 

[happyelf]

I dunno, the bit about legal costs really reads like the kind of thing you'd expect a legal department to 'strongly recommend' to it's bosses.

 

[ShakaUVM]

A big slice of the major d20 publishing segment now has refused the GSL and 4E. Other important names include Paizo and Green Ronin. A third player, Kenzar, has decided to take the interesting route of putting out 4E compatible products without using the GSL. It will be interesting to see if the Hasbro lawyers sit still for that one.

I also wouldn't be surprised if Kenzer had a special arrangement with WOTC.

Kenzer has gotten WOTC's nuts in a vice before, legal-wise (WOTC printed Knights of the Dinner Table without permission, and gave them a ton of concessions in order to avoid getting sued -- ever wonder why Living KoK was supported after the RPGA dumped all the other 3rd party campaigns?).

There could be something else going on here besides just making Fair Use 4ed books.

 

[Voadam]

I also wouldn't be surprised if Kenzer had a special arrangement with WOTC.

Kenzer has gotten WOTC's nuts in a vice before, legal-wise (WOTC printed Knights of the Dinner Table without permission, and gave them a ton of concessions in order to avoid getting sued -- ever wonder why Living KoK was supported after the RPGA dumped all the other 3rd party campaigns?).

There could be something else going on here besides just making Fair Use 4ed books.

Kenzer made 2e stuff before that occurred without any special license. They have stated the settlement was for specific benefits which are now over (making humorous Hackmaster versions of various older edition books, using the 3e D&D logo on books, etc.). Kenzer staff have stated how they are surprised people feel the need for a license to make rules compatible material and referred to their pre settlement 2e compatible modules and CS.

It is possible there is a new secret agreement between WotC and Kenzer licensing them the right to make 4e stuff outside of the GSL without any acknowledgement or logos like their already released 4e Kalamar CS, but I doubt it.

 

[Orcus]

I personally don't believe the community can do anything a this point ... just as those at TSR virtually ignored it's supporters/customers, WotC seems to be taking a similar stance thinking they are completely right, and damn what everyone else thinks. I mean, regardless of how perfect the GSL to be, there's always a better way.

Clark/Orcus is probably the last remaining hope to have the GSL amended to benefit the entire D&D-based hobby. Good thing he's a tenacious, and has the best interests of the hobby in mind.

Jeez, thanks LMD! That's nice of you too say.

Listen, I have come out strongly and said I wouldnt adopt the GSL as is. BUT that doesnt mean I wouldnt adopt it with some changes or clarifications. And I remain convinced that Wizards will listen, that they want the GSL to succeed and that they dont view it currently as a success. Now, I'm not letting them off the hook. I think the GSL so far has been handled very poorly. I'd say bungled. Wait, I just did say bungled But am still very hopeful that change will happen. Some say I am too much of an optimist. I guess we will see...