Rashak Mani
First Post
The first thing that came to my mind now is the fact that in Vietnam the number of American GIs who were "casualties" due to venereal disease.... some things never change... just transform...
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Reading Group--Caesar's Legion
- Thread starter SHARK
- Start date
That's been a problem in every war -- certainly in the American Civil War, WWI, and WWII. At one point during the Civil War, the authorities realized they could keep prostitution above board, check the prostitutes for diseases, keep the sick ones out of circulation, and practically end venereal disease. After the war, they of course drove it underground again.
Chapter IX -- The Race for Durres (continued)
"We have come almost to the end of our toils and dangers," Caesar went on. "You may therefore leave your slaves and baggage behind in Italy with easy minds. You must embark with only basic kit to allow a greater number of troops to be put on board the ships available. When we win, my generosity in reward will answer all your hopes."
He's suitably vague about the reward. I find it interesting that soldiers at war are expected to have slaves, and I have to wonder where you put your slaves while you're away fighting in Greece. Who looks after them?
"We have come almost to the end of our toils and dangers," Caesar went on. "You may therefore leave your slaves and baggage behind in Italy with easy minds. You must embark with only basic kit to allow a greater number of troops to be put on board the ships available. When we win, my generosity in reward will answer all your hopes."
He's suitably vague about the reward. I find it interesting that soldiers at war are expected to have slaves, and I have to wonder where you put your slaves while you're away fighting in Greece. Who looks after them?
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Maldur
First Post
They put them in a slavehostel 
So leaving their bagage behind They now operate on just the thing they can carry on thier backs. As their javelins are one-shot weapons, I can only imagin every legionair stoking up on those. Crazy conditions on those shis. Legionairs packed in holds and on decks. must be demoralizing leaving your luxuries/loved ones/slaves behind.
In modern nato training a percentage of soldiers drops out ( due accidents etc) , I wonder what the atrition-rate would be on campaigns like this. Lesser Medical, more people, walking every where. It seems undoable without many casualties.
So leaving their bagage behind They now operate on just the thing they can carry on thier backs. As their javelins are one-shot weapons, I can only imagin every legionair stoking up on those. Crazy conditions on those shis. Legionairs packed in holds and on decks. must be demoralizing leaving your luxuries/loved ones/slaves behind.
In modern nato training a percentage of soldiers drops out ( due accidents etc) , I wonder what the atrition-rate would be on campaigns like this. Lesser Medical, more people, walking every where. It seems undoable without many casualties.
I wouldn't assume that the Romans has less effective care for twisted ankles, etc. than modern armies, and I would assume that the Roman armies had better-walking soldiers than modern armies; they'd been hiking/marching regularly their whole lives. And they certainly had a lot fewer traffic accidents.
Chapter IX -- The Race for Durres (continued)
Even though they probably weren't particularly popular with his men, Caesar had a penchant for amphibious landings and nigh operations. He liked the way an amphibious assault could deliver a mass of troops to one place at one time. He also liked to use the elment of surprise that darkness provided, recognizing...that "the mightiest weapon of war is surprise."
Very Sun Tzu. If the men have to be "sardined" in the hold, seasick, so be it.
In modern times, Caesar would have been a great exponent of the use of paratroops and the US Marine Corps for troop insertions.
And finally we see why SHARK really recommended Caesar's Legion!
Even though they probably weren't particularly popular with his men, Caesar had a penchant for amphibious landings and nigh operations. He liked the way an amphibious assault could deliver a mass of troops to one place at one time. He also liked to use the elment of surprise that darkness provided, recognizing...that "the mightiest weapon of war is surprise."
Very Sun Tzu. If the men have to be "sardined" in the hold, seasick, so be it.
In modern times, Caesar would have been a great exponent of the use of paratroops and the US Marine Corps for troop insertions.
And finally we see why SHARK really recommended Caesar's Legion!
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Chapter IX -- The Race for Durres (continued)
They'd invaded Britain twice, after all. But that had been different. There had been no opposition naval forces lurking in the darkness when they crossed the English Channel. Now, somewhere out ther in the night, picket ships of Pompey's navy might appear at any moment.
That would be terribly scary, sitting more-or-less hopeless in a troop transport as the enemy's navy appears.
They'd invaded Britain twice, after all. But that had been different. There had been no opposition naval forces lurking in the darkness when they crossed the English Channel. Now, somewhere out ther in the night, picket ships of Pompey's navy might appear at any moment.
That would be terribly scary, sitting more-or-less hopeless in a troop transport as the enemy's navy appears.
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Chapter IX -- The Race for Durres (continued)
The landing of the troops of the first wave had taken longer than it should have....Before long, the strong breeze that traditionally blew from the south on January nights dropped away. Soon the empty transports were drifting helplessly, within sight of the coast....Thirty of Caesar's troopships were captured.
At least Caesar is lucky enough to lose his transports after they've delivered their payloads.
...Bibulus decided to make an example of the captured vessels.
"Burn them," he ordered.
"And their captains and crews, Admiral?" a subordinate would have asked.
"Leave them where they are."
Brutal.
The burning bolts [dipped in tar] were fired at the cargo vessels. Soon all thirty were burning fiercely as the crews of the warships all around them watched the spectacle in engrossed, ghoulish silence. Those crewmen on the thirty doomed transports who didn't burn to death were drowned when they jumped into the cold, dark waters to escape the flames. Any who tried to swim to the Pompeian warships were fended off, and they, too, were eventually claimed by the waves.
Grisly.
The landing of the troops of the first wave had taken longer than it should have....Before long, the strong breeze that traditionally blew from the south on January nights dropped away. Soon the empty transports were drifting helplessly, within sight of the coast....Thirty of Caesar's troopships were captured.
At least Caesar is lucky enough to lose his transports after they've delivered their payloads.
...Bibulus decided to make an example of the captured vessels.
"Burn them," he ordered.
"And their captains and crews, Admiral?" a subordinate would have asked.
"Leave them where they are."
Brutal.
The burning bolts [dipped in tar] were fired at the cargo vessels. Soon all thirty were burning fiercely as the crews of the warships all around them watched the spectacle in engrossed, ghoulish silence. Those crewmen on the thirty doomed transports who didn't burn to death were drowned when they jumped into the cold, dark waters to escape the flames. Any who tried to swim to the Pompeian warships were fended off, and they, too, were eventually claimed by the waves.
Grisly.
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Maldur
First Post
I had a slow day at work this morning so I had time to read the last few chapters.
Rough opinion about the whole book.
The book starts great with explaining the earlier days of the legion, giving a view of the scale legions operated in. The techniques and tactics used. And how Ceasar used them (particular the 10th , as this is the focal point of the book).
I am still impressed by the scale of things.
The amount of troops used, the speed of maneuvering, and the engineering feats performed.
The middle of the book, about the civil war Ceasar finds himself in, is slightly less about the legions and more about Ceasar, ending in the climatic Assasination scene we all know. ( E tu Brutu?) Legion acomplishments are more a list of dates when what legion whent where, do do something. Still there are some great images to be found amoung these lists. ( mmadsen finds most of them!)
The book ends in a more crunchy style ( like the first part). The focus is on the 10th legion, scetching their exploits in the middle east. Again the brutal efficienty of the legions amaze me.
All in all a great read! If you like roman (or SHARKS valladorian) Legions it's a must read.
I think SHARK can use several ideas from the last chapters ( the sieges of Jerusalem and Masala) in his defense of the mountain fortress.
The writer has done research on several different "individual" legions. It might be interesting to see what the other legions have been up to, even though a lot of legions are described in this book. But what be more interesting are other thing he might be able to tell us about the roman military machine. Techniques, teactics, Equipment, etc all with a backdrop of anecdotes and example stories Ill scout around if he wrote any more. ( or do you know allready, SHARK?)
PS I will keep asking (strange) questions on other post on this thread. Dont think youll get rid of me this easily.
Rough opinion about the whole book.
The book starts great with explaining the earlier days of the legion, giving a view of the scale legions operated in. The techniques and tactics used. And how Ceasar used them (particular the 10th , as this is the focal point of the book).
I am still impressed by the scale of things.
The amount of troops used, the speed of maneuvering, and the engineering feats performed.
The middle of the book, about the civil war Ceasar finds himself in, is slightly less about the legions and more about Ceasar, ending in the climatic Assasination scene we all know. ( E tu Brutu?) Legion acomplishments are more a list of dates when what legion whent where, do do something. Still there are some great images to be found amoung these lists. ( mmadsen finds most of them!)
The book ends in a more crunchy style ( like the first part). The focus is on the 10th legion, scetching their exploits in the middle east. Again the brutal efficienty of the legions amaze me.
All in all a great read! If you like roman (or SHARKS valladorian) Legions it's a must read.
I think SHARK can use several ideas from the last chapters ( the sieges of Jerusalem and Masala) in his defense of the mountain fortress.
The writer has done research on several different "individual" legions. It might be interesting to see what the other legions have been up to, even though a lot of legions are described in this book. But what be more interesting are other thing he might be able to tell us about the roman military machine. Techniques, teactics, Equipment, etc all with a backdrop of anecdotes and example stories
Ill scout around if he wrote any more. ( or do you know allready, SHARK?)PS I will keep asking (strange) questions on other post on this thread. Dont think youll get rid of me this easily.
Rashak Mani
First Post
How would you guys rate the book overall ?
5 - A must buy
4 - Worthwhile/Good
3 - OK
2 - For Roman Fanatics only
1 - Forget it
5 - A must buy
4 - Worthwhile/Good
3 - OK
2 - For Roman Fanatics only
1 - Forget it
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