Real-time needed to run combats (simili-poll)

[Sammael99]

OK, as I explained in the "how long do combats last", I'm worried that combats eat up to much time to run in my campaign. I'm wondering if that changes as levels go up, if we don't sufficiently master the rules or what...

I can't run this by a simple poll though, because I'd need to know two things, not just one :

a. What average level is the party considered
b. How long does the combat take to run on average

I think I should only considered combat that is roughly matched to the party's level, so if you use CRs, combat encounters that are of a CR equal to that of the party or if you don't use CR rules, combats that roughly deplete 1/4 of the party resources.

Here's my contribution :

Party Level : 8
Average Time to Run : 1 1/2 hrs

I'll consolidate all the contributions and post averages. Please contribute !!!!

 

[haiiro]

I'll bite. I'm in two games at the moment:

Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil:
Average Party Level: 8 (but only 3 players)
Average Combat Length: 1 hour, 15 minutes

Banewarrens:
Average Party Level: 6
Average Combat Length: 30 minutes

The Banewarrens estimate is difficult to make, as we haven't gotten very far into the module. The RttToEE estimate is more accurate.

Edit: Changed the RttToEE estimate to reflect not including battles of CR 8 or higher. Don't know how I missed that in the post.

 

[el-remmen]

Party Level: 6th (but has much less magic than "standard" for 3E)
Approx. Combat Real Time: One and a half hours (about 13 rounds of game time).

I don't really pay much attention to CR - but I would say that a CR equal to the party's average level or one lower is usually a balanced fight.

 

[Sammael99]

Thanks guys.

So my 1.5 average doesn't seem so off this far. 'gad ! That's nearly half the alloted game time for each combat !!!

 

[Drawmack]

PL: 4
E Length: 15 - 30 minutes

I have some rules that extremely stream line battle. In this I am not counting the first step of the process below. Here is how combats run at my table

15 minutes initial set up and strategy. I set up the scenario and leave the room and allow the PCs to plot against me.
Each round starts with 1 minute prep time.
During your turn you've got 6seconds to state an action or forfeit your turn.

With a 6 person group this gives everyone 1:36 to decide what they are going to do in the next round. This should be enough time for even the 20th level caster do pick a spell to use. I does force my players to be a bit more intimate with their characters but it moves battle along very quickly.

 

[jester47]

I cruise at about 1 to 1.5 hours for a normal combat at a regular CR.

There are some things you can do to shorten combat though.

1. Follow the suggestions in the Core Books. I think in the DMG there is a section on good habits to use to speed up combat.

2. Use abstract combat. If the combat is not critical to the story or if the outcome is all you really need, dont worry about the tactics involved. If the Monsters are CR or better combat will be lethal, if the monsters are CR or lower then there is very little chance that someone will die. Instead of doing each round, have a one round roll off to determine the outcome. Average the ABs (ranged and melee) and add that to a d20 roll. Thats the attack roll for the participant. if the attack roll is higher than the characters max AC then the character takes what ammounts to two hits from a lesser CR creature or is killed by a greater CR creature. Combat is then over. The system is crude but it would save you lots of time if the fights are not all that important.

3. Add goals to your fights. Set it up so that if a goal is achieved, the fight is over. The goal might be to get away, to obtain an item, to subdue but not kill the opponents, to kill one guy. Think of those games like red rover and steal the bacon. Also, have enemies break and run when things go bad.

All these things will help run faster combats.

Aaron.

 

[el-remmen]

No offense, but those seem like horrible suggestions? If the combats are fun, who cares how long they take?

It would be disappointing to me have a combat "just end" because a "goal" was achieved - and while I do not insist on minis every time - I always play out every combat - even a lowly kobold could get lucky.

 

[Lucius Foxhound]

I've got to agree with nemmerle... those are some terrible suggestions!

An essential part of D&D is dice-rolling... that without that, there's really not much point in having any stats for your characters.

But one idea that you may have hinted at is that the DM should consider making some morale rolls once a big-bad is killed. It would shorten combat considerably if you didn't have to hunt down every "lowly kobold"... it seems reasonable that some of them would run or give up at some point.

 

[el-remmen]

Well, morale rolls (or their equivalent) go without saying. . . It should reasonabley expected that opponents will sometimes surrender - hell, smart PCs sometimes surrender- if they think they won't be immediately killed.

 

[jester47]

The abstact combat is for surprise random encounters if you play that way. Besides, in the abstact idea that I presented, a kobold can still get lucky. if he rolls a 20 he gets to do 4d6 to a PC (allowing for criticals). and that might be enough to bring a PC down. Its a tool that is good to use when you figure you want a random outcome but you really dont have time or the encounter is against somthing you know the party will beat but might take out a PC.

As for the goal oriented combat I am not saying the combat is over when the goal is achieved. I am saying that if the players purpose is to enter a room and steal say a key, they may find it much easier to just have one person run in and grab it while the others run interference and then the party tries to get out of the room. Combats last much longer when the goal is genocide of everything non PC in the room.

The more critical somthing gets to the story the slower the game progresses. Thus combat will always be slow.

Aaron.