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<blockquote data-quote="Blue Orange" data-source="post: 8781200" data-attributes="member: 7025997"><p>So, I admit, you are right.</p><p></p><p>So wait, we're talking about bigotry? Well, I am of partial Jewish ancestry, which allows me to talk about that history, which has a wide variety of acceptance over different countries and time periods, including some, ah, <em><strong><span style="color: rgb(150, 75, 0)">very bad</span></strong></em> periods. (I'm not nuts about the you're-only-allowed-to-talk-about-your-own-kind rule, but I guess it helps me here.)</p><p></p><p>And it's not always obvious which country was the right one over the long term. I mean, Germany was better than Russia in 1900. Not so in 1940. You can come up with some general rules (left-wing dictatorships better than right-wing, better odds if the country speaks English for some reason) but it has more to do with historical contingency--all the Dutch Jews died less because the Dutch were raving antisemites than because they were super organized so they had lists of everyone and they weren't big enough to resist the Germans effectively. Conversely, the Danish Jews survived because they were geographically able to ship them to Sweden. So, basically, <em>any degree</em> of bigotry has the possibility to turn malignant, because once you're set apart the general public is tempted to turn you in if a hostile foreign power invades. (Or the mood shifts, in countries like the USA where invasion is difficult.)</p><p></p><p>I will quibble that you're not necessarily always moving toward the finish line--there was discrimination against British Jews after they came back from exile but it never went genocidal, these things can go back and forth without ever reaching that point. But you're not wrong to take a zero-tolerance approach if you fear extermination. (Also, while 4chan is pretty bad, Reddit subreddits vary hugely depending on moderation.)</p><p></p><p>Finis.</p><p></p><p>(I'm still sorry the Jewish thread got shut down. I really wanted to come up with some lists of magic bagels.)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Blue Orange, post: 8781200, member: 7025997"] So, I admit, you are right. So wait, we're talking about bigotry? Well, I am of partial Jewish ancestry, which allows me to talk about that history, which has a wide variety of acceptance over different countries and time periods, including some, ah, [I][B][COLOR=rgb(150, 75, 0)]very bad[/COLOR][/B][/I][B] [/B]periods. (I'm not nuts about the you're-only-allowed-to-talk-about-your-own-kind rule, but I guess it helps me here.) And it's not always obvious which country was the right one over the long term. I mean, Germany was better than Russia in 1900. Not so in 1940. You can come up with some general rules (left-wing dictatorships better than right-wing, better odds if the country speaks English for some reason) but it has more to do with historical contingency--all the Dutch Jews died less because the Dutch were raving antisemites than because they were super organized so they had lists of everyone and they weren't big enough to resist the Germans effectively. Conversely, the Danish Jews survived because they were geographically able to ship them to Sweden. So, basically, [I]any degree[/I] of bigotry has the possibility to turn malignant, because once you're set apart the general public is tempted to turn you in if a hostile foreign power invades. (Or the mood shifts, in countries like the USA where invasion is difficult.) I will quibble that you're not necessarily always moving toward the finish line--there was discrimination against British Jews after they came back from exile but it never went genocidal, these things can go back and forth without ever reaching that point. But you're not wrong to take a zero-tolerance approach if you fear extermination. (Also, while 4chan is pretty bad, Reddit subreddits vary hugely depending on moderation.) Finis. (I'm still sorry the Jewish thread got shut down. I really wanted to come up with some lists of magic bagels.) [/QUOTE]
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