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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DM-Rocco" data-source="post: 3440175" data-attributes="member: 14451">My players in one game (all spell casters of one kind or another) once spent 3 1/2 actual hours figuring out a buffing system that they labeled the "Royal with Cheese."  The following battle was not even close to being lost.They did it one more time, the battle went slightly better, but things were still greatly messed up.  I then banned persistant spells, level variable factors for Holy Word (which the 16th level cleric was casting at level 32, don't ask how that one got away from me) and put some limits on the players.  Not very many mind you, but something had to be done.  The game balance breaks down for spell caster around 13th-15th level.  Somewhere in there things just get nuts.  If you have an Artificier in the group, say good buy to even having a close battle again.  Once they can change the type of bonus gained from an item, they can get any AC through the roof.That being said, high level characters should have lots of protections.  In a standard D&D game with a well balanced party their should always be some if not all of the protections you listed above.  However, if as a DM you have, over the course of months or years, let the power level of the characters slip from you, then don't be afirad to set limits or as a last ditch effort, remove items that are giving you problems.The natural tendency is to place harder encounters in front of them.  Which is fine, to a certain point, but that can be a slippery slope as sometimes that means equiping them with gear that makes them more powerful and thus giving that gear to your party when they die.  You can however have encounters at a normal encounter level and equip them with one shot items that would solve this, like giving them scrolls of Greater Dispel Magic, Scry or Break Enchantment.  If that is not enough, there is always the deal breaker, Mort's Disjunction.You can also get sly by having enemy wizards cast things like Dimensional Anchor so that party can't hit and run.  However, have the wizards make bluff checks as they cast so the group spell casters don't know what spell is being cast.  At the same time have some one throw a fireball their way.  Then they will think that just a fireball hit them and not get it in their heads that anything is wrong until they teleport away, or try to.</blockquote>

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