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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ashockney" data-source="post: 3440863" data-attributes="member: 1363">None needed, I'm honored. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />  At about anywhere around 12th level and up, it becomes ridiculous.  The higher level game ABSOLUTELY assumes that all pcs are buffed.  As others have pointed out (the royale with cheese) my example was really "big boys off the top of my head" and did not fully flesh out all the options.  If you have played above 12th, and ESPECIALLY above 15th, if you're not buffed to some degree, you're dead.  It is just too deadly.  For both villians and players the game becomes "how do I become immune to that" and "ok, they can't be immune to everything, so which thing we can do will work".There's a number of threads out there about how to run effective high level games.  I've posted in many of those, and will try to be brief.  Many of the key ideas have been highlighted already:1) Change the scope of your game - dungeon crawling is too limited in scope for high level2) Anti-magic fields3) Dispelling4) Buff your villians5) Employ more dynamic villians, especially BBEG6) Where possible provide more "environmental" and "non-combat" challenges7) Use MORE villians (ie, a typical encounter should outnumber the party 2:1, 3:1)These strategies, still allow for some variety for PC's but grant you a bit of freedom as a DM to continue to challenge your PC's at higher levels.  Regretably, you just don't have the kind of flexibility and freedom you do as a DM to run any appropriate EL encounter with no prior preparation, like you do from about 3rd level - 9th level, where the game plays super sweet.A couple of notes to those who've made comments:USING CHARACTER ABILITIES should not ever equal UNCREATIVE/UNFAIR/BORINGAs a DM, I always assume if somethings put in the game, it's there for a reason, and it should be expected to be used.  Characters should get the opportunity to flex their muscles.HIGH LEVEL PLAY is TOO COMPLEXI've written a lot about this elsewhere, so I won't beat a dead horse.  Just for reference, however, what exactly were you planning on doing with your 1st - 3rd level spells?  If you think you're using a fireball on anything above 15th level, you're really just kidding yourself.  Buffs (particularly some of the swift action ones in the new books) become one of, if not the only, viable option to find a relevant use for these 25 of their 50 spells for the day.</blockquote>

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