Rogue hiding where there isn't anywhere to hide
- Thread starter Kichwas
- Start date
Shard O'Glase
First Post
I'm in the no-go absurd penalties camp(epic might make those absurd penalties). As pointed out the skill references needing a place to hide. I think it's just assumed that as a general rule most rooms, places etc have a place to hide.
But also some items I could see always give you a palce to hide. Someone mentioned a blanket painted the backgorunds color. A ring of chamelian should be able to let you hide in a blank corridor.(still big penalties but it should be possible)
But also some items I could see always give you a palce to hide. Someone mentioned a blanket painted the backgorunds color. A ring of chamelian should be able to let you hide in a blank corridor.(still big penalties but it should be possible)
Dr. NRG
First Post
Any case that makes you say, "a character shouldn't be able to do that," should be carefully examined when that ability is identified as supernatural.
Can a monk run faster than an accelerating motorcycle? Naturally not, right? Supernaturally, however.... who's to say?
Shadowdancers that are attempting to hide in plain sight are breaking normal, natural laws. Thus their ability is supernatural.
The ability does, however, require some shadow, which the scenario above does not include. I think this is simply a case where following the rule as written will work perfectly fine. The shadowdancer should not be able to hide in plain sight in the scenario because there is no shadow, as opposed to him not being able to hide in plain sight because there is no cover... these are two different things.
Can a monk run faster than an accelerating motorcycle? Naturally not, right? Supernaturally, however.... who's to say?
Shadowdancers that are attempting to hide in plain sight are breaking normal, natural laws. Thus their ability is supernatural.
The ability does, however, require some shadow, which the scenario above does not include. I think this is simply a case where following the rule as written will work perfectly fine. The shadowdancer should not be able to hide in plain sight in the scenario because there is no shadow, as opposed to him not being able to hide in plain sight because there is no cover... these are two different things.
Kichwas
Half-breed
I've been in a number of situations in recent gaming where rogues 'hid' and then popped out of nowhere in the middle of a room right in front of their chosen targets...
Or situations where the rogue was in the same hallway as us, in front of us, a member of our group, and lacking any location they could hide in, but we could not see them.
It's been essentially treated as the invisibility spell. Which drives me nuts...
A player tried to pull it on me about a year and a half ago and I let it go at the time as I didn't want an argument...
I think I'm going to bring it up in my current game, but I suspect they'll continue to use it like a supernatural ability.
Or situations where the rogue was in the same hallway as us, in front of us, a member of our group, and lacking any location they could hide in, but we could not see them.
It's been essentially treated as the invisibility spell. Which drives me nuts...
A player tried to pull it on me about a year and a half ago and I let it go at the time as I didn't want an argument...
I think I'm going to bring it up in my current game, but I suspect they'll continue to use it like a supernatural ability.
arcady said:I've been in a number of situations in recent gaming where rogues 'hid' and then popped out of nowhere in the middle of a room right in front of their chosen targets...
Or situations where the rogue was in the same hallway as us, in front of us, a member of our group, and lacking any location they could hide in, but we could not see them.
It's been essentially treated as the invisibility spell. Which drives me nuts...
A player tried to pull it on me about a year and a half ago and I let it go at the time as I didn't want an argument...
I think I'm going to bring it up in my current game, but I suspect they'll continue to use it like a supernatural ability.
I've seen that problem too.
We always assume IMC that if its dark, like a dungeon, then you can hide even with no cover, you just hide in the dark. But with light around, you shoulnd't be able to just hide anywhere in a room.
Shard: I don't think using the nearly impossible rules of -20 in this case is absurd. Basically it would involve using the dust on the floor, a low point on the floor, every scrap of concealment that you could muster. And most likely you'll still fail, most people's spot isn't great but at -20 we are still talkign an easy spot.
Its the difference between a guy who can hide (low level character who uses dex to hide) vs a guy who understands what hiding is really about (high level character with a lot of ranks who can just sometimes make teh near impossible happen.
Nearly impossible is one thing. Actually impossible is something else. 
If a rogue wants to hide behind the trunk of an oak tree, that's a normal check.
If he wants to hide behind a sapling thinner than his body, that's nearly impossible. He could try to change his outline and be non-obvious, but he's still within view, hence the -20 penalty.
If he's standing in a bare hallway and has nothing to hide behind, he's just SOL. At epic levels, he might drape his cloak over himself and manage to look like a nondescript boulder or a chunk of the wall, but it still won't be easy. I'd let him try, but with a -50 penalty on his check.
If a rogue wants to hide behind the trunk of an oak tree, that's a normal check.
If he wants to hide behind a sapling thinner than his body, that's nearly impossible. He could try to change his outline and be non-obvious, but he's still within view, hence the -20 penalty.
If he's standing in a bare hallway and has nothing to hide behind, he's just SOL. At epic levels, he might drape his cloak over himself and manage to look like a nondescript boulder or a chunk of the wall, but it still won't be easy. I'd let him try, but with a -50 penalty on his check.
Chun-tzu
First Post
Hel-LO?!? Haven't any of you guys ever seen a Bugs Bunny cartoon?
All you need to do is bring a lamp shade with you everywhere. Whenever you want to hide, put the lamp shade on your head and stand still. It works every time. Even in settings that precede the discovery of electricity.
All you need to do is bring a lamp shade with you everywhere. Whenever you want to hide, put the lamp shade on your head and stand still. It works every time. Even in settings that precede the discovery of electricity.
I'll probably get trash thrown at for this but...:
What if it wa avery dimly lit hallway with drab, stone walls. The halfling rogue is wearing drab colored robes, dirty from her last fight, and is huddled in a corner, silent and still.
I think that there is a possibility that she can pull it off if the people are not aware she is there, and are preoccupied with something else (argument).
But if they are a guard, and are actively looking- no chance in hell-o
What if it wa avery dimly lit hallway with drab, stone walls. The halfling rogue is wearing drab colored robes, dirty from her last fight, and is huddled in a corner, silent and still.
I think that there is a possibility that she can pull it off if the people are not aware she is there, and are preoccupied with something else (argument).
But if they are a guard, and are actively looking- no chance in hell-o
