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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 9230345" data-attributes="member: 7030563">This really depends on the build, and in particular their ability scores.   Rogue as a class is very SAD relying only on Dexterity, and without need for a high Constitution like other martials.  This enables Rogues to boost other abilities more easily than other classes, and this translates to higher skills across the board.  The extra ASI helps in this regard too. I disagree with this.  Expertise makes up a ton of ground, I've played Rogues with an 8 strength who are the best grapplers in the party.  Clerics and Druids don't have Perception on their skill list, so it is not true to assume they will be better at this than a Rogue.   A Rogue or Ranger will usually have the highest passive perception in the party IME.  Not always, but usually, and that is before we consider Reliable Talent.A Rogue can usually play with either a good Charisma or a good Wisdom and that combined with Reliable Talent and Expertise means they will generally be better than most other classes at what they choose to be good at.Spells can do a lot, but they are limited both by the number known/prepared and by spell slots, and when it comes to high level spells you are pretty much restricted to 1 slot per day.</blockquote>