Roman "knights" ?? - need ideas

[Emiricol]

Hi. I've got a situation where I have a culture based very closely on the Romans - equipment, government, armies, etc - and considering the recent Dragon #299 on Knights, I thought it'd be fun to see what ideas we can come up with for knights in that environment!

Obviously, the traditional model for knights won't work (especially since the culture is based on money as wealth, not land as wealth, which really affects the whole social dynamic). And, there's no nobles per se - governors, senate, emperor yes, dukes and barons no.

So - what do ya think?

 

[BiggusGeekus]

I've got something similar.

http://www.murchadslegacy.com/impskin.htm

(the "roman" PrC is the first one on the page. It's probably obvious that I'm not talking about the orc one further down, but belaboring the obvious validates my existence.)

But the legionaires are one of the older entities in the empire. So it might be too "traditional" for you.

Happy gaming!

 

[Emiricol]

Hey, BG! Great site! In mine legionnaires are just an army of Fighters. I've got a feat progression for the typical legionnaire. I should come up with a PrCl I suppose...

But it isn't quite a knight either way. I'm looking for something a bit outside the normal scope of traditional Romanesque ideas, yet fitting in with the culture, structure, etc. (your legionnaires ARE quite unique, though!)

Being a DM, I usually think I know the best way to do anything but I haven't ever really done anything like this before for a Roman structure heh.

 

[Ace]

There was a Roman (I think Late period) social class, rather a moneyed horsey set called Equites that might make a good set of proto knights.

Given the Byzantine Cataphracts (scale armored Cavalry units) a Roman style Code of Honor and you have knightly units.

While they would still be part of the legion they are all of Patrician class and that would give them a lot of privleges within the Legion itself.

Oh FYI depending on the period arms would be Lammelar or Scale Armor (or Chain Mail) on the Rider and optionally the Horse , Spatha (Longsword) and Hasta (Long Spear) unlike Knights they might also have Javelins (Pila) for throwing.

To increase combat effectiveness drop the highback saddle the Romans used and give them stirrups, then you can heavy heavy lance charges.

 

[MeepoTheMighty]

Mmm, this discussion makes me want to play some Republic of Rome. Ye gods, that was a fun game.


I ROLL FOR A KNIGHT!

 

[Breakdaddy]

Off topic, but I thought it was "emiriKol the chaotic", not emiricol

 

[Emiricol]

Heh, well - twenty years ago when I started w/AD&D, I thought I was being terribly creative when I took the name and changed the spelling. Hey, I was 10. Anyway - been using it ever since

 

[Eosin the Red]

There were also special units that while not historically knightish could be morphed - take the Varangian Guard re-write their history and style "poof" instant Knightly order. Perhaps an old group like the Spartans is still around, still effective but their home has changed political tones and they are no longer accepted.

The Stretgos (sp?) School for the formation of you military minds and future generals used in a novel (I don't know about IRL) could provide an interesting basis for a knightly order.

You best bet would be to look at religions though. Not sure how your cosmology/mythology is set up but having sects devoted to some of the old gods could inspire them to train other like minded folks in an unusual style of combat. They would be a small organization until the threats posed by the mongels or other horse riding folk reared their heads.


Was that way off or did it actaully provide anything of use?

 

[Emiricol]

Hi Eosin - I'll have to check out the Varangian Guard. Hopefully it will spark the ol' imagination

As to other religions, I suppose that could work. The place in question is a Hobgoblin empire where, naturally, the hobgoblins are the Citizens (goblins and bugbears, and GNOMES (aka greeks), having been enslaved long ago). Centaurs beyond the borders serve the same purpose as the huns, though at an earlier stage of development than in the real world.

The empire mainly worships a NE god of tyranny, tactics, territory and slaughter, who happens to have created the goblinoid races. The society is very very open, however, to foreign gods and ideas (long story on that). I might be able to work it in with a neutral god.

As you can see, I sort of painted myself into a corner. Between the lack of vassal/liege dynamics, coin-based economy, and the whole god thing... Also, the equestrian class already serve in the legions as a separate cavalry detachment, with spatha and shortspears. And since all the legionaires are hobgoblins, martial prowess isn't as compelling a reason for knights as it would be in other nations.

 

[Eosin the Red]

The empire mainly worships a NE god of tyranny, tactics, territory and slaughter, who happens to have created the goblinoid races.

I think you may have part of your answer right here.

A sect of military zelots devoted to the tactics aspect of the diety. Maybe they are followers of some Saint of battle? They live for battle perhaps even farming themselves out in forgien wars.