RP Challenges: The Jaded PC

Once they stop being mindless, do they lose that special quality that makes them immune to mind affecting spells?

The way they've constructed the entry explaining Vermin traits, they seem to have made the vermin's mindlessness explictly only an attribute of its lack of intelligence and not a separate quality. Compare for example with the Plant entry.

Looking back to the entry on intelligence: "A creature with no Intelligence score is mindless, an automaton operating on simple instincts or programmed instructions. It has immunity to mind-affecting effects (charms, compulsions, phantasms, patterns, and morale effects) and automatically fails Intelligence checks."

Ergo, fiendish vermin are not immune to mind-affecting effects.
 

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There are a lot of things that might be possible. Yes the Ranger/Druid could use Survival to keep them on track. He could use a bird form to scout far and wide for landmarks, or at least for water hols. (Those really are the only real fixed landmarks in a ea of sand.)

The Barbarian/Wizard (3/12) is certainly high enough to call up an Elemental or even Elemental Lord for guidance, if he had the spells and thought in those lines.

The Cleric/Wizard/Mystic Thurge could do it too. As could his cohort the Bard. As could the Cleric. I'm pretty sure the Cleric's Healer cohort could pull a rabbit out as well.

My money's on the Druid/Ranger as the eventual problem solver.

As for the Walk spells: The character they normally go to for Shadow Walk is my character, who isn't in this adventure. Because of the split classes most have gone with I don't actually know if any of them can cast Wind Walk. I know that I've never seen it cast, nor heard any mention of it.

We're relatively weak for our levels. No dedicated fighter types, most everyone in less-than-optimal split classes. Heck, my Bard/Sandshaper/Sublime Chord is the "big gun" in terms of offensive magic. And it's sad when you're counting on the Bard as your artillery.

I was thinking of throwing a Colossal Fiendish Monstrous Scorpion at them (CR 14, pretty much right out of the MM 1), but I'm thinking it would be a TPK. (Note: I'm thinking that the Fiendish template, which gives the monster a minimum Int of 3, will actually weaken in a way it by making it subject to mind affecting spells.)

If their Cleric provides a Hero's Feast to feed them then the critter's poison sting becomes a simple melee weapon, and he's just another blob of hitpoints type monster. I'll bet money that he won't think of that in advance, even though they just ran into the smaller versions of the same monster. (I even threw in a Harryhousen (sp?) pun to give them a bit of warning.)

I hate to speak ill of my friends/game group, but I think they've had it too soft for too long. Because you're right, this should be an eminently defeatable situation, with or without warnings.
 

I hate to speak ill of my friends/game group, but I think they've had it too soft for too long. Because you're right, this should be an eminently defeatable situation, with or without warnings.

Yep. If you've got them to 15th level and you are still wearing the kid gloves, you've babied them too long. Time to start pushing them out of the nest. They are big boys. They've got raise dead. It's time they started pulling weight equal to their pay grade.
 

Well, I haven't been the DM for 15 levels. It's been a group exercise.

Here are relatively common spells they don't use:

Blur - Gives 20% miss chance, regardless of the enemy's attack bonus.
Displacement - Gives 50% miss chance, regardless of enemy's attack bonus.
Detect Evil - Gives you a clue who/what you're dealing with.
See Invisible - No comment necessary.
Mirror Image - Variable miss chance.
Shield - Adds 4 points of AC, stops Magic Missile spells
False Life - Lets the spell bleed so you don't have to.

Their offensive spell list is as follows:
Fireball
Scorching Ray
Lightning Bolt
Magic Missile
Ice Storm
and rarely... Cone of Cold

That's about it. I focus on the spells because we don't have a real Fighter type,nor a real Rogue. We have exactly one character in the party who isn't a spell caster.

One of them wasted precious action-round time trying to cast Doom on some Giant Scorpion. A 1st level mind-affecting spell that gives the enemy a -1 to hit, wasted on a Vermin type that's immune anyway, even if it couldn't make the Save in its sleep.

And the Druid still loves to try Entangle, even when he's in places where there really isn't any plant life for it to utilize.

Now, this past week I more or less convinced them that Hero's Feast is a good idea. Up until now the Cleric had only cast it as a special treat for some favored NPC. Even after I told them that pretty much all the African tribes used poison on their weapons, they missed the clue. Even after their Healer got poisoned by monstrous scorpion, they missed the clue. Even after they saw their guide saving the poison from one of the scorpion, for his own uses, they missed the clue. They would have walked into the Colossal Monstrous Scorpion (DC 33 poison save, D10 of Con damage) if I hadn't had some bad guys work to get their NPC/Cohort Bard addicted to something nasty. That convinced them that the poison immunity was worthwhile, even if it is only for 12 hours, and hence wouldn't have protected their Bard (Drugs were slipped into his evening meals).

The Colossal scorpion I mentioned did waste an attack slaughtering one of their draft-camel. I also reminded them that they could use Shrink Item on water barrels or chests of supplies. Maybe now they'll abandon that stupid cart and start moving faster than 15 overland.

They also realized (maybe) that the Druid's Transport via Plants could take them to the waterhole nearest their goal all in one shot. They'd only been thinking of it as having a 4 creature limit because they had an amulet that could do it with that limit once per day. So we'll see if they decide to shortcut several weeks of desert encounters.

They did manage to knock out one of the enemy conspiracy, a member of the Illumian Cabal that they've been chasing and never getting close to.

Their next action? The Druid arrived first in bird form, changed to Human, and executed the unconscious man. I gave the Barb/Wiz (ostensible party leader) the opportunity to Message the Druid with advice. He did, and his advice was, "Do a good job on him!"

So they lost a (so far) unique information opportunity. Just threw it away. I wanted to cry.

To be honest, I'm starting to think that they deserve to fail on this mission.

We'll see if the survive my next encounter. Specifically, we'll see if anybody remembers the Stone Salve I provided, or thinks to throw Death Ward before messing with the undead, or the Giants. (Oddly, the undead I'm using are the ones who petrify, and the giants are the ones with the death magic. Kind of a reversal.)

I have a couple of sets of ruins for them to waste time in, and the requisite Mummy as well. (It wouldn't be a Sahara adventure without Pyramids, ruins and a Mummy or two, now would it? :) )
 

I've been watchng the group and thinking about things they say and do, and I think I have it figured out.

They're not stupid (I never believed that they were), but because of the progressive DM nature of our campaign, nobody wants to rock the boat too much for the next DM. They don't give out any single items that are so big they're going to disrupt the plans of the next DM in line.

Plus, we've had dedicated power gamers in the group before and nobody wants to be accused of that. As a result, we're sort of underachievers.

So let's think about AC and defense: Presume that you have 120,000 or so to equip a character. Dexes tend to be 14 or 16, we're spellcaster heavy and nobody wants to drop their move to 20 by wearing heavier armors. DMG, Arms and Equipment, Magic Item Compendium, and the Completes are available sources.

How would you equip a character of 15th/16th level so they'd have an AC in the high 20s to low 30s?
 

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