Sidekick: do you remember who the ref was? I have to say that over the past few years I've seen quite a few forward passes allowed by SH referees. I liked the ref for the Ireland-Australia game, though; Marius Jonker of South Africa. He seemed to understand that his job was to facilitate the game, not dominate it.
Rugby: Autumn Internationals
- Thread starter Dioltach
- Start date
Goblyns Hoard
First Post
Dioltach - didn't catch the game but the ref was Chris White (England). He's gotten some criticism over the years for not being a top level ref but I must say I have no idea - I can't recall ever seeing him ref a game. Probably have done but can't think of any at the moment.
Sidekick - whilst I agree that the game should flow as much as possible I have to say if the laws are broken then the whistle has to go (unless the ref is playing advantage obviously). If that means the game is stop-start then it's only the players that are at fault - they need to stop infringing if they want the game to flow. And given how the ABs were repeatedly lying on the ball and infringing at the breakdown vs England (to the point of Masoe eventually being sent off for it) it's also a bit rich to hear complaints about the game not being able to flow. I've got to also add it takes a brave Kiwi to be complaining about refs not seeing forward passes
Sidekick - whilst I agree that the game should flow as much as possible I have to say if the laws are broken then the whistle has to go (unless the ref is playing advantage obviously). If that means the game is stop-start then it's only the players that are at fault - they need to stop infringing if they want the game to flow. And given how the ABs were repeatedly lying on the ball and infringing at the breakdown vs England (to the point of Masoe eventually being sent off for it) it's also a bit rich to hear complaints about the game not being able to flow. I've got to also add it takes a brave Kiwi to be complaining about refs not seeing forward passes
Am I the only one disappointed that England failed to break the record against South Africa?
It was looking promising at half time, and was touch and go for the second half, only for them to throw it away in the dying minutes.
Goodness only knows how long it will be before England gets another chance to lose eight in a row.
It was looking promising at half time, and was touch and go for the second half, only for them to throw it away in the dying minutes.
Goodness only knows how long it will be before England gets another chance to lose eight in a row.
Well, an ambiguous weekend of rugby so far. I only saw the Wales v NZ game, and part of Scotland v Australia, but I hope to catch the highlights of the England game this afternoon and then watch Ireland against the Islanders -- that should be a good one, with lots of running rugby and hard tackles.
Wales looked hopeless against the All Blacks: despite their possession and territory, they rarely managed to convert anything into points. While NZ seemed to score whenever they felt like picking up the ball. It's almost as if they decided to focus purely on their defensive skills yesterday.
Australia seem to have gelled somewhat; I expect them to keep improving over the coming year. They'll be a force to be reckoned with come the World Cup.
A typically battling display from Scotland, from what I saw of it. Lots of spirit, but lacking in precision. With New Zealand and a continually improving Italy in their group at the WC, they may struggle to reach the knock-out stages.
And finally, England ... Like I said, I haven't seen the match yet, but judging by the reports they have only got worse as the series progressed. It seems ironic that their best display was perhaps against the All Blacks, and in fact they've fared better against NZ than any of the other countries. But it's just been downhill from there on. How can Andy Robinson justify his position now? He keeps repeating that he wants to see the job through, and to bring England back to where they should be, but they've just got worse over the past 22 games. Interestingly, BBC Five Live are reported to have said that, according to "a well-placed source", Robinson is on the way out, to be replaced by Martin Johnson. Now I know that I was joking earlier that Johnno could instil some fear and discipline into the team, but I'm not sure yet whether he has his coaching credentials, or if he even wants to be involved; although I'm sure every rugby fan in England (except visiting New Zealanders, of course!) would like nothing more than a chance to say their piece and try to help things along.
So, Robinson out? Sounds good to me. And although Johnno might not be head coach material yet, I'd love to see him involved in some way. One thing is certain, though: unless things change in the current set-up, England will struggle in the Six Nations, and by then it will be too late to prepare properly for the World Cup.
Wales looked hopeless against the All Blacks: despite their possession and territory, they rarely managed to convert anything into points. While NZ seemed to score whenever they felt like picking up the ball. It's almost as if they decided to focus purely on their defensive skills yesterday.
Australia seem to have gelled somewhat; I expect them to keep improving over the coming year. They'll be a force to be reckoned with come the World Cup.
A typically battling display from Scotland, from what I saw of it. Lots of spirit, but lacking in precision. With New Zealand and a continually improving Italy in their group at the WC, they may struggle to reach the knock-out stages.
And finally, England ... Like I said, I haven't seen the match yet, but judging by the reports they have only got worse as the series progressed. It seems ironic that their best display was perhaps against the All Blacks, and in fact they've fared better against NZ than any of the other countries. But it's just been downhill from there on. How can Andy Robinson justify his position now? He keeps repeating that he wants to see the job through, and to bring England back to where they should be, but they've just got worse over the past 22 games. Interestingly, BBC Five Live are reported to have said that, according to "a well-placed source", Robinson is on the way out, to be replaced by Martin Johnson. Now I know that I was joking earlier that Johnno could instil some fear and discipline into the team, but I'm not sure yet whether he has his coaching credentials, or if he even wants to be involved; although I'm sure every rugby fan in England (except visiting New Zealanders, of course!) would like nothing more than a chance to say their piece and try to help things along.
So, Robinson out? Sounds good to me. And although Johnno might not be head coach material yet, I'd love to see him involved in some way. One thing is certain, though: unless things change in the current set-up, England will struggle in the Six Nations, and by then it will be too late to prepare properly for the World Cup.
Hawklord
First Post
I think England need to forget about the next Word Cup and focus on 2011 instead. They were just poor at the weekend - so many stupid errors a basic lack of skills.
At least Scotand and Wales, although outclassed put up a good fight.
Ireland are the only NH team with any kind of chance for next year.
At least Scotand and Wales, although outclassed put up a good fight.
Ireland are the only NH team with any kind of chance for next year.
Sidekick
First Post
Forward passing – yeah sure it happens a bit in the Super 14. But to say that it’s a common event is a stretching the truth. I call the ABs of forward passes as well as the opposition.
The ref just needs to be consistent in that sort of thing. Flat passes should be given the benefit of the doubt. But blatantly forward ones should be penalised.
Its hardly rocket science.
Richie and the infringements: Yeah Masoe and McCaw infringe a lot. And that’s one of the bits that I don’t like about the ABs. But apart from the holding the ball up (which is poor if you ask me) the loose forwards are the players who operate in the area of the game that has the most subjective and ambiguous rules – the rucks and mauls.
The refe decides when a maul if formed and if your in the middle of a 70,000 capacity stadium running full bore into a tackle to nabt the ball in a legal manner then often by the time you get there someone’s called RUCK as your taking the ball. – its hard.
Also, lets face it everyone does it. Have the ABs had any penalty tries awarded agsint them recently? Nope – but the welsh did. New Zealand may ‘cheat’ in the grey areas, but ultimately they just do it better than the opposition.
You can bet your bottom dollar that in school rugby and club rugby the same things are happening – heck it’s common to get punched at the bottom of a ruck in local grades – just not in view of the ref.
It’s a dirty game people.
Anyway back to the autumn internationals.
Ireland – about time these dudes showed what they can do. I really like O’Driscoll, O’Garra and co. They know their rugby. I’m dead keen to see what they can do in the 6 nations.
France: How did that team get 2nd in the world? My left cheek they’re 2nd!!! They were woeful and I think they got the wake-up call they needed at the hands of the ABs.
England – where to begin. Fire the coach, fire the captain, get a half-back and 1st 5 with talent. Then the players need to listen to Brian Ashton. Then they might make a semi-final next year.
Maybe – I’d be planning for the 2011 as someone else has mentioned.
Scotland – didn’t see any of their games so can’t comment.
Saffa’s – White needed that win. They’ve got talent and I do feel sorry for SA’s coaches. The regular internationals are against NZ & Australia every year and then they’re expected to come up this way and win everything. Hard task if you ask me.
Aussie – they’re just tricking us./ Just you wait until next year. Gregan will lead the troops to at least a semi spot.
All Black – we need to a) find a first team, b) gell together and c) actually hit top gear. Because I’m sorry people but only in the first game against France were our boys actually trying their hardest. The rest of the time it felt like they were coasting and just focussing on not letting in tries.
I mean against Wales we scored when we pleased. Nick Evans – a man who can’t get on the field at 1st Five set up a try with his FIRST TOUCH of the game. Dan Carter isn’t the All Black’s, he’s just our best of many talented players (no one but Evans & him at no 10 though)…
If anyone is going to compete with the All Blacks next year then they need to
A) get tougher, bigger & faster
B) get smarter in the breakdown (fight fire w fire)
C) have depth past 18 players (which will be a BIG ask for some)
D) Get the basics right everytime
Essentially if someone want’s to compete with New Zealand the way they are playing. They need a drastic overhaul of their skills, physique, tactics, defensive play you name it, it needs work.
Of course, chances are we’ll come completely unstuck between now and then and it’ll all go to pot.
But it won’t!! New Zealand will be defending the World Cup at home come 2011!!!
The ref just needs to be consistent in that sort of thing. Flat passes should be given the benefit of the doubt. But blatantly forward ones should be penalised.
Its hardly rocket science.
Richie and the infringements: Yeah Masoe and McCaw infringe a lot. And that’s one of the bits that I don’t like about the ABs. But apart from the holding the ball up (which is poor if you ask me) the loose forwards are the players who operate in the area of the game that has the most subjective and ambiguous rules – the rucks and mauls.
The refe decides when a maul if formed and if your in the middle of a 70,000 capacity stadium running full bore into a tackle to nabt the ball in a legal manner then often by the time you get there someone’s called RUCK as your taking the ball. – its hard.
Also, lets face it everyone does it. Have the ABs had any penalty tries awarded agsint them recently? Nope – but the welsh did. New Zealand may ‘cheat’ in the grey areas, but ultimately they just do it better than the opposition.
You can bet your bottom dollar that in school rugby and club rugby the same things are happening – heck it’s common to get punched at the bottom of a ruck in local grades – just not in view of the ref.
It’s a dirty game people.
Anyway back to the autumn internationals.
Ireland – about time these dudes showed what they can do. I really like O’Driscoll, O’Garra and co. They know their rugby. I’m dead keen to see what they can do in the 6 nations.
France: How did that team get 2nd in the world? My left cheek they’re 2nd!!! They were woeful and I think they got the wake-up call they needed at the hands of the ABs.
England – where to begin. Fire the coach, fire the captain, get a half-back and 1st 5 with talent. Then the players need to listen to Brian Ashton. Then they might make a semi-final next year.
Maybe – I’d be planning for the 2011 as someone else has mentioned.
Scotland – didn’t see any of their games so can’t comment.
Saffa’s – White needed that win. They’ve got talent and I do feel sorry for SA’s coaches. The regular internationals are against NZ & Australia every year and then they’re expected to come up this way and win everything. Hard task if you ask me.
Aussie – they’re just tricking us./ Just you wait until next year. Gregan will lead the troops to at least a semi spot.
All Black – we need to a) find a first team, b) gell together and c) actually hit top gear. Because I’m sorry people but only in the first game against France were our boys actually trying their hardest. The rest of the time it felt like they were coasting and just focussing on not letting in tries.
I mean against Wales we scored when we pleased. Nick Evans – a man who can’t get on the field at 1st Five set up a try with his FIRST TOUCH of the game. Dan Carter isn’t the All Black’s, he’s just our best of many talented players (no one but Evans & him at no 10 though)…
If anyone is going to compete with the All Blacks next year then they need to
A) get tougher, bigger & faster
B) get smarter in the breakdown (fight fire w fire)
C) have depth past 18 players (which will be a BIG ask for some)
D) Get the basics right everytime
Essentially if someone want’s to compete with New Zealand the way they are playing. They need a drastic overhaul of their skills, physique, tactics, defensive play you name it, it needs work.
Of course, chances are we’ll come completely unstuck between now and then and it’ll all go to pot.
But it won’t!! New Zealand will be defending the World Cup at home come 2011!!!
Hawklord
First Post
Dioltach said:
I think it' s probably too late though - at least for the next Work Cup.
Robinson had to go, just as we had to get rid of Matt Williams - it just wasn't working out.
However I suspect that Robinson's right, until the RFU sort out the structural issues in the English game I doubt anyone could fix England in time.
I hear Martin Johnson's the favourite to replace Robinson but I'm not sure that would work either!
Sidekick
First Post
Yeah I heard about that. Ultimately its good for world Rugby so I’m happy. Robinson was simply not up to the task, but then again it Took Woodward 7 years of planning a preparation along with his players peaking in age, skill and experience at just the right time to win the last World Cup.
You can’t expect too much from whomever replaces Robinson as the structure is still the same, at least they’re keeping Ashton. If they ditch him then they can kiss any chance of performing well in the World Cup good bye.
I agree that England need to focus on the 2011 cup, next years title is beyond them…
Mainly because it’s ours though
You can’t expect too much from whomever replaces Robinson as the structure is still the same, at least they’re keeping Ashton. If they ditch him then they can kiss any chance of performing well in the World Cup good bye.
I agree that England need to focus on the 2011 cup, next years title is beyond them…
Mainly because it’s ours though
Similar Threads
