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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6260191" data-attributes="member: 87792">Which is more than the never it has ever been affected by the spellcasting power of one person.And&nbsp; in many cases (especially Genghiz Khan) the leader was leader because&nbsp; they were a kick-ass fighter.&nbsp; In other cases (Gustavus Adolphus,&nbsp; Richard the Lionheart, Charles Martel) they didn't have to fight their&nbsp; way up - but their personal skill in battle and ability to take to the&nbsp; front lines was a huge factor in raising the morale of their troops.&nbsp; (I&nbsp; think that the 30 Years War was the final European war where this was&nbsp; the case; gunpowder weapons make it too easy for a peasant thirty yards&nbsp; away to take down any warrior).&nbsp; Arthur and Lancelot in the myths, and&nbsp; Conan in the stories were all very much leaders in this school.Hector&nbsp; and Achiles impact compared to Odysseus?&nbsp; Seriously?&nbsp; You need to&nbsp; re-read the Iliad.&nbsp; Odysseus had one major impact on the course of the&nbsp; Trojan War (the Wooden Horse).&nbsp; He then spent the next ten years&nbsp; struggling to sail a ship from one end of the Aegean to the other.&nbsp; And&nbsp; he only got his chance because Achiles was powerful enough that when he&nbsp; wasn't in the battle (before the death of Patroclus) the Greeks were&nbsp; being pushed back into the sea, and when he was the Greeks were&nbsp; winning.&nbsp; Achiles mere appearance on the battlefield caused the Trojan&nbsp; army to flee back behind the walls.&nbsp; In short, Achiles presence on the&nbsp; battlefield was enough to rout a victorious army.And I've said it before and I'll say it again, Save or Die should be the exclusive&nbsp; domain of the fighter.&nbsp; I don't care who you are, having a sword&nbsp; through your brain or your head cut off is a kill.&nbsp; Unfortunately&nbsp; D&amp;D warriors (in any edition) wield nerf-bats rather than swords.&nbsp; And wizards have enough power to make Gandalf green with envy.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 6260191, member: 87792"] Which is more than the never it has ever been affected by the spellcasting power of one person. And in many cases (especially Genghiz Khan) the leader was leader because they were a kick-ass fighter. In other cases (Gustavus Adolphus, Richard the Lionheart, Charles Martel) they didn't have to fight their way up - but their personal skill in battle and ability to take to the front lines was a huge factor in raising the morale of their troops. (I think that the 30 Years War was the final European war where this was the case; gunpowder weapons make it too easy for a peasant thirty yards away to take down any warrior). Arthur and Lancelot in the myths, and Conan in the stories were all very much leaders in this school. Hector and Achiles impact compared to Odysseus? Seriously? You need to re-read the Iliad. Odysseus had one major impact on the course of the Trojan War (the Wooden Horse). He then spent the next ten years struggling to sail a ship from one end of the Aegean to the other. And he only got his chance because Achiles was powerful enough that when he wasn't in the battle (before the death of Patroclus) the Greeks were being pushed back into the sea, and when he was the Greeks were winning. Achiles mere appearance on the battlefield caused the Trojan army to flee back behind the walls. In short, Achiles presence on the battlefield was enough to rout a victorious army. And I've said it before and I'll say it again, Save or Die should be the [I]exclusive[/I] domain of the fighter. I don't care who you are, having a sword through your brain or your head cut off is a kill. Unfortunately D&D warriors (in any edition) wield nerf-bats rather than swords. And wizards have enough power to make Gandalf green with envy. [/QUOTE]

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