D&D 5E Running a Port

[Quickleaf]

I think that's something we'll eventually get into. I don't want this to dominate their time for the rest of the campaign, but finding that balance between what's happening everywhere in the world and how it affects the players and their assets is a unique challenge. But once the players have successfully laid the ground work for their Port, there has so be some semblance of conflict every now and then. It's D&D afterall.

The problem with the DMG's downtime rules is that it doesn't scale well, as evidenced in the links [MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION] provided below. I don't want the running of a large port to be on the same scale of profitability as a pop-up stand on the side of a busy road.

I think that link I gave you answers the gold piece accounting question well by providing solutions to the strange economy implied by the DMG downtime rules.

However, if I was in your shoes that would just be one small fraction of the design.

Here's the direction I'd go in:

What makes a port desirable to PCs?

1. Access to Rare Stocks. Befriend/attract/engage the right merchants and you may gain access to improved stocks from far afield. This might even include spells, magic items, masterwork arms, etc.
2. Scope of Information/News. Similarly, invest in the right taverns/merchant houses/dockworker housing (or paying the right spies), and you may gain access to a greater/more international pool of news (i.e. your "Gather Information" skill – or whatever equiv. you use in 5e – gains a much greater scope).
3. Ship Passage. Broker passage on a variety of ship to far-away locations...where you can meet the local monsters, kill them, and take their treasure.
4. Naval Building/Actions. Assemble a navy which you can use to guard allied merchant ships against pirates, create blockades of enemy city-states, etc.
5. Making Money. Some players may be interested in accumulating lots of gold. I've found this to be rare in 5e unless you're including ways to spend gold that aren't built into the system (e.g. using a homebrew Strongholds document).

Those are the main things of interest to PCs that are unique to a port. Maybe I've missed 1 or 2, so add those in.

Then you come up with some kind of rough ranking system (1-5) for each category, requiring X gp/time passed/quest goals accomplished to advance in rank. So you might have Access to Rare Stocks: 0, which basically means standard PHB equipment (modified according to culture/tech level), and then say, OK, if PCs pursue connections with a couple merchants, they can boost that to Access to Rare Stocks: 1, which you might interpret as some combo of low expense poisons, common magic items, exotic weapons, etc. I would just have a loose idea, since in actual play, I'd be adapting this to what the players actually decide, which NPCs they actually choose to engage with, etc.

Then with Scope of Information/News, you'd basically treat 0 as the local region, 1 as neighboring ports accessed through shallow coastal watercraft, 2 further ports accessed through shallow coastal watercraft, 3 further ports accessed through deep watercraft, 4 hidden, magically concealed, or hard-to-access ports, 5 very distant ports. This would affect the scope of what a PC learns by "asking around" or calling upon certain background features, and how broad their "early warning system" extends in the even of incoming threats.

Then set up a rough 1-5 ranking for the other categories.

IOW, rather than focusing on just the money side of things – focus on the broader reasons why players care about controlling a port. What can this do for us? Maybe we can make money...but that's not it's own end...why do we care? Access to goods, access to information, access to new places, and naval power.

 

[Sunseeker]

So far the players have invested a good amount of time into this project. It's less them putting something on my plate and hoping I gift them gold, and more that they see this as an opportunity. They have a keep, they have a port, they might as well use it. So far they've hired a Steward, who they trust, and a Port Master, who they shouldn't trust. I mentioned the communications they've had with the Dwarves but they've also will be traveling to the local communities to see what can come from that.

It seems, from my impression, that they care and are willing to invest both game-time and game-money into making this work. However they have expressed that they do not want to spend the rest of their time managing this port of theirs.

Then I would say something like 10g/mo per trade deal or maybe a simple 100g/mo with a die roll to determine crit success or crit failure.

 

[pming]

Hiya!

I'd pull out my Hackmaster (4th) Lord Flataroy's Guide to Fortifications, a map of the elevation contours of the area they can 'build' in, and tell them they have, oh, 150k GP's to spend on it. Go!



Basically, they are going to have the heada...er..."pleasure" of running a keep/port. They are going to get the coin/debt that it incurs and everything, so I figure they should be the ones to 'design' everything they want about it.

Of course, if they just say "Oh man...too much work. Can't we just say it's a keep by a bay and handwave the rest?". Well, ok...boring...but ok. If that's the case I'd just take 10 minutes to come up with a simple table with a bunch of possibilities of what might happen, good/bad, with most being 'break even'. Then the PC's can just say "Well, this month we're going to take the treasure we got from adventuring and put in...oh, 5000gp to the keep, port, town etc. I then roll my dice. The results would be things like "Pirates attack! (x0.7 multiplier)", or maybe "New trade route found! (x1.2)", or perhaps "Nasty sickness (x0.5)", etc, etc. So, basically, at the end of the month, the players 5k could end up being 2.5k (meaning they lost money), or it could be 6k (meaning they made money). I would have only ONE result be the 'jackpot', of x2...but I'd have TWO results be 'really bad', of x0.1. Hey, nobody said running a successful port town and keep is easy!

Hopefully my players would go for a more hands-on approach (re: the full on Lord Flataroy's), because it adds a rather large, and cool, dimension to the game...imho, of course.

^_^

Paul L. Ming

 

[Imaculata]

I think that's something we'll eventually get into. I don't want this to dominate their time for the rest of the campaign, but finding that balance between what's happening everywhere in the world and how it affects the players and their assets is a unique challenge. But once the players have successfully laid the ground work for their Port, there has so be some semblance of conflict every now and then. It's D&D afterall.

Why not merge it with the main campaign, and make it a central part of it? The players have already shown to have a strong desire to establish their own base. So why not reward them with that, by letting that base be a vehicle for the rest of the plot?

I'm kind of in the same situation as you. My players have established their own base on a remote island, and have started their own trade emporium. So I now work that into the plot. The players have various issues concerning their base that they need to resolve, such as the safety of the island, securing the trade routes, and the safety of the port itself. And obviously the bad guys are going to attempt a big attack on the port, which the players will need to be ready for. I've never played out a big siege in DnD before, but it sounds very exciting. The players love their base, and so it makes sense to take the plot to that base, and use it for further adventures.

What makes a port desirable to PCs?

1. Access to Rare Stocks. Befriend/attract/engage the right merchants and you may gain access to improved stocks from far afield. This might even include spells, magic items, masterwork arms, etc.
2. Scope of Information/News. Similarly, invest in the right taverns/merchant houses/dockworker housing (or paying the right spies), and you may gain access to a greater/more international pool of news (i.e. your "Gather Information" skill – or whatever equiv. you use in 5e – gains a much greater scope).
3. Ship Passage. Broker passage on a variety of ship to far-away locations...where you can meet the local monsters, kill them, and take their treasure.
4. Naval Building/Actions. Assemble a navy which you can use to guard allied merchant ships against pirates, create blockades of enemy city-states, etc.
5. Making Money. Some players may be interested in accumulating lots of gold. I've found this to be rare in 5e unless you're including ways to spend gold that aren't built into the system (e.g. using a homebrew Strongholds document).

Those are the main things of interest to PCs that are unique to a port. Maybe I've missed 1 or 2, so add those in.

Then you come up with some kind of rough ranking system (1-5) for each category, requiring X gp/time passed/quest goals accomplished to advance in rank. So you might have Access to Rare Stocks: 0, which basically means standard PHB equipment (modified according to culture/tech level), and then say, OK, if PCs pursue connections with a couple merchants, they can boost that to Access to Rare Stocks: 1, which you might interpret as some combo of low expense poisons, common magic items, exotic weapons, etc. I would just have a loose idea, since in actual play, I'd be adapting this to what the players actually decide, which NPCs they actually choose to engage with, etc.

Then with Scope of Information/News, you'd basically treat 0 as the local region, 1 as neighboring ports accessed through shallow coastal watercraft, 2 further ports accessed through shallow coastal watercraft, 3 further ports accessed through deep watercraft, 4 hidden, magically concealed, or hard-to-access ports, 5 very distant ports. This would affect the scope of what a PC learns by "asking around" or calling upon certain background features, and how broad their "early warning system" extends in the even of incoming threats.

Then set up a rough 1-5 ranking for the other categories.

IOW, rather than focusing on just the money side of things – focus on the broader reasons why players care about controlling a port. What can this do for us? Maybe we can make money...but that's not it's own end...why do we care? Access to goods, access to information, access to new places, and naval power.

I really love your ideas, and I think I will work them into my own campaign. I especially like the idea of having various categories with ranks, that they can upgrade by doing missions for the port.

Port security

Construction: Watch towers / a gate / port defenses (cannons) / barracks
Manpower: Guards / lookouts / a fleet / a commander
Missions: Finding and destroying the cannibal village / killing the cannibal leader

Consequences:
Completing any two of these tasks could upgrade the security of the port by one. Currently the biggest threats to the port are random cannibal attacks that endanger the safety of their workers (this makes it harder to recruit new staff). The risk of a massive siege by the big bad and his forces on the port, by land or sea. Any pirate invasion by sea.

Port information

Construction: Watchtowers (again), rookery, mage tower, lighthouse
Manpower: Scouts / Prospectors / Scout vessels / Mage
Missions: Arrange spies / Make political allies

Consequences:
Currently the players have very little information about the island on which their port is based, and an attack could come unexpectedly from any side of the island, or from sea. They have no means to warn or receive warnings from nearby settlements. Completing any two tasks would increase the range from which they obtain information, and depending on their choices, the type of information they receive.

Port commerce

Construction: Smithy / Drydock and/or shipyard / Stores / Inn
Manpower: Merchants / crafting specialists / harbormaster / smugglers
Missions: Defeat any trade route threats / Gain access to specialized equipment from local factions

Consequences:
The players will need to get trade going to an island that is feared by many because of all the cannibals. The players will need to build the appropriate buildings and take care of local threats that disrupt trade. Without this, their trade vessels are at risk of attacks from sea monsters and enemy pirates. Establishing connections with smugglers could improve their access to illegal goods, but puts their alliance with the local kingdom at risk. Improving their connections with local pirate tribes, gives them access to specialized weapons, ship upgrades and equipment.

 

[jasper]

Ok, my players only did a bought a bar and keep. IIRC I did a chart where they randomly rolling the income for the month then loss 90% in various costs. I then had a special encounter chart. I think was 01-20% bad. 80%+ good. And no effect in the middle. They used the chart when they were out adventuring.
When they were home, I created adventures like people are doing above. Good luck.

 

[Eltab]

If the PCs don't want the campaign to revolve around the port, then set up a 3d6 roll where they get enough profit to maintain a Nice -or- Really Nice -or- REALLY NICE lifestyle without having to worry about the accounting.
If they want to buy an expensive item (that 5000 GP ruby for a spell focus, say, or some magic equipment) then it takes them down to Plain lifestyle for 2d6 months.

If the PCs DO want the campaign to revolve around the port, check out 3e Power of Faerun which includes a chapter on Trade & Commerce.