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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Technik4" data-source="post: 372800" data-attributes="member: 7211">My .02Sorry, but I still don't see those disadvantages as balancing an ECL 0. The hit die thing is funky too. +2 hp/hit die is arguably more powerful than simply letting a higher die role. Its like a +4 to constitution!I like the negatives for skills among non-savages.Permanent cross-class I don't agree with. For instance, in Jens original model, you could eventually become civilized. The skills wouldn't be cross-class then would they?As far as all knowledge but nature, that is just silly. Savages might have a better knowledge than civilized people about the lay of the land (geography), the spirit world (spirit), or even the arcane (arcane). Afterall, a savage wizard would have a lot of old spots in the earth to commune with, and would certainly have some arcane lore.This is my take on ECL +0 Savage Template.Savage-Creating a Savage-"Savage" is a template that can be added to any non-lawful corporeal humanoid (referred to hereafter as the "base humanoid"). It uses all the humanoid's statistics and special abilities except as noted here.Weapon Proficiency: The base humanoid gains proficiency in the hand axe.Armor Proficiency: If the base humanoid would gain heavy armor proficiency through a class bonus, it is not gained. It must be taken as a feat.Language Proficiency: The base humanoid is illiterate. It can neither read nor write. Hit Dice: Increased by one die type, to a maximum of d12.Skills: Intimidate is always a class skill.Feats: The following feats may be chosen as long as the other pre-requisites are met: Fast Movement, Barbaric Rage, Uncanny Dodge (Dex+Flank), Uncanny Dodge (Traps), Damage Reduction, Savage Skills.Spell-casting Hindrance: All savage spell-casters subtract 1 from their "spells cast per day" chart. If this would reduce the spells to 0, the caster may only cast a spell if they have a bonus spell.Sample Savage HumanoidSavage Human Ranger 3Hit Die: 3d12+3 (28)Initiative: +2Speed: 40 ft.AC: 15Attacks: +6 Mwk. Greataxe (or +6 Mwk. Handaxe)Damage: 1d12+3 (or 1d6+2)Saves: 4/3/2Abilities: Str 14 Dex 15 Con 13 Int 10 Wis 12 Cha 8Skills: Wilderness Lore +7, Spot +12, M. Silently +8, Hide +8, Intimidate +5.Feats: Track, Two-Weapon Fighting, Ambidexterity, Fast Movement, Barbaric Rage, Uncanny Dodge. Favored Enemy- Beasts.Equipment: Mwk. Studded Leather Armor, Mwk. Greataxe, Mwk. Handaxe, 3 potions of cure lt wounds, Eyes of the Eagle.While Raging (lasts 6 rounds): Hit Die: 3d12+9 (34)AC: 13Attacks: +8 Mwk. Greataxe (or +8 Mwk. Handaxe)Damage: 1d12+6 (or 1d6+4)Saves: 4/3/4Thats about as far as I can stretch it and not cost it an ECL. Giving more skill points, or more class skills is, imo, too far. As you may or may not notice, this is essentially a brb2/rgr1. The important difference is that when this character hits level 5, he gets an increase in all his ranger abilities, including favored enemy and spell-casting. The multi-classer would be 2 levels behind, and depending on the humanoids favored class, might be pushing exp penalties.Therefore, I don't think the template should give any more than what I have outlined above.Technik.</blockquote>

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