Saving the Bard

[GMMichael]

But if you want a more complex social mechanic it isn't hard to dream one up. Pemerton's example from Prince Valiant has one that works just like combat - a pool of hit points (social points?) that get worn away. It is possible to have something where the participants use different tactics to achieve different goals; say befriending, embarrassing someone or just trying to score points in front of an audience. I recently dreamed up something like this for my HERO game; and all based on opposed skill rolls.

I don't know the Fate system, how do Aspects work?

"Progress" points is what I like to call them. Which is actually a more accurate name for hit points, based on how they're usually treated.

An Aspect is a word or phrase that has something to do with your character. Simple as that. When one applies to a roll you're about to make, you get +2 on the result. I think. I haven't played Fate for as long as I can remember.

I did play a bard in Dungeon World. . . He was also the character with the highest armor rating, being better defended than the group's paladin.

That's...just...wrong. Unless: magic.

Bards in 5E really do nicely as 2/3 face-man, 2/3 cleric, and 1/3 combattant. (Yes, I know that totals 5/3, but only if you don't allow overlaps. And the overlaps matter.)

Several of my parties preferred a bard to a cleric. Not that they'd turn one away, but they want the bard.

This begs the question: IS the 5e bard actually a bard? Or just a cleric who has a musical instrument? Did 5e save the bard by putting the real bard out of his misery?

 

[TarionzCousin]

Bards as characters are popular in the fiction if he is a "Don Juan" ( = a womanizer libertine) but in the dungeons there aren't girls to be dated.

Ahem.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

The bard was created, or adapted, to be a buffer, perfect as secondary or deuteragonist, but not for main character.

Maybe the bard needs only the right character in the main media fiction, something like a mixture of Jack Parrow, Katniss Everdeen (Hunger Games), Disney's Descendants and Equestria Girls, princess and pauper, fairy tale and picaresque novel, artist with a sensitive heart but also a cynical mouth. Somebody who would rather astuteness, tongue and talent than brute force.

Music-Based Abilities

powerlisting.fandom.com

Musical Assassin - TV Tropes

Musical assassins are hitmen with style. Who needs guns when you can lay waste to your enemies with a carefully-calculated concerto? Techniques start out at Brown Notes and only get more ridiculous from there. These assassins are especially …

tvtropes.org

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Yes, some bards have got really weird tastes.

 

[aramis erak]

This begs the question: IS the 5e bard actually a bard? Or just a cleric who has a musical instrument? Did 5e save the bard by putting the real bard out of his misery?

Really, it's a uniquely D&D thing that barely looks like it's original in-game version nor their real-world inspirations...

 

[Don Durito]

I don't really get the 5E Bard. It just basically does everything.

Sure they can buff - but so can lots of characters. What do they get other than Bardic Inspiration (which is an awkward mechanic) which really facilitates this roll?

I think if I was designing a bard for 5E I'd give them some kind of mechanic where they can use music to keep several concentration spells going at the same time.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Really, it's a uniquely D&D thing that barely looks like it's original in-game version nor their real-world inspirations...

So, just like the wizard, cleric, sorcerer, ranger, ...

 

[Tony Vargas]

...and , really, no one's done this yet...?

Have you saved a bard lately?

:sigh:

...in Soviet Russia BARD SAVE YOU!!!

 

[aramis erak]

So, just like the wizard, cleric, sorcerer, ranger, ...

The cleric and the wizard are, within the scope of the "Vancian" magic system, pretty close to the tropes of fantasy novels. The bard is not.

Noting of course, that the Vancian magic isn't a match to Vance's first three novels (as far as I could stand to read of it). And that the proper term is Magic-User for OE, but I'll use Wizard for that class. Sorcerers and Rangers are later additions.

From the various stories, we know Merlin can Polymorph others, locate objects, become invisible, lock doors, open doors, clairvoyance and clairaudience, plant growth and charm monsters... all of which amount to 4th level wizard under OE. In some flavors, he was also able to talk with animals...

Morgan also can polymorph, and she's able to hold person on Merlin... and has a number of other things..

Both really do fill the bill for being 9th level wizards.
Gandalf is only using spells equivalent to a 5th level wizard, & he's a demigod, as well. (See the article in Dragon about this.)

The cleric really seems to be more akin to Van Helsing and the tales of the various miracle working bishops in the Lives of the Saints than the typical fantasy clergy pre-D&D — for what little I've read in Fantasy lit — the OE spell list is a good match to both the Lives of the Saints and to the Egyptian Book of the Dead, with a healthy dose of the various norse Goði.

The Wizard really is a good fit to the fiction base.

Rangers have several prototypicals which were explicitly mentioned in the article introducing them; again, the adaptation is reasonable, within the class/level/vancian-magic paradigm.

In all cases, yes, they do become their own thing, in the same way that D&D is now essentially its own genre

Now, to be fair, I don't generally read fantasy, save for the classics my mother used as bedtime stories. What I have read includes Howard (I've read a bunch of both Kull and Conan), Tolkien's Hobbit & LOTR, most of Anne McCaffrey's output, Bujold's Curse of Chalion, the first few Dying Earth novels, Costikyan's Cups and Sorcery books, the Lost Regiment series, half a dozen Dragonlance novels, A bunch of ERBoroughs, a smattering of others, and a number of norse sagas, several variations on arthurian myth (I wonder just how many drugs TH White was on...). And a lot of mythology — both Christian and classical Greco-Roman, and some norse.

That said, the Magic-User as introduced in D&D OE is consistent with the MU class abilites.

 

[Don Durito]

The cleric and the wizard are, within the scope of the "Vancian" magic system, pretty close to the tropes of fantasy novels. The bard is not.

Where can you find a Cleric in a novel that's not based on D&D?

 

[Phion]

To be honest some players are just made to be the face of the party and have a higher wit and charisma themselves that make them ideal for such classes with superior skills sets. Also the class tends to determine the style of face you play. If I intend to become a more of a social character I find my personality suits more of a mentor/advisor (druid/cleric) role or a straight up trickster (rogue swashbuckler) who charms people with a silver tongue and gets the party caught up into mischief; they are forgiven typically because it brings about good results or I have warped reality with my words to convince the good characters that it was not directly my fault.

However I could not be the face as a paladin as I don't really wield a personality that demands instant respect from the players or other characters which I personally feel I would need. As for the bard, I would struggle to be the face because I am not very good at story telling; it could be argued I could use the same style as my rogue but I think the danger of sneak attack and my general willingness to commit crimes to my benefit adds a element of....dare I say aggressive negotiations.