Sell me on "Magical Medieval Society" WE

[Crothian]

It really depends on what your gaming world is like, and what you want out of gaming. If your gameing is more like LotR or Conan, then the book is not going to be as useful to you. Like all books, it more depends on what you need or will get use out of.

 

[d4]

[off-topic]FWIW, Joshua, which GURPS books did you find particularly dubious? i've been a big fan of their historical series for some time, but i'll admit my own knowledge of history is not the greatest.

any departures from real-world history i always took as trying to make the setting more suited to a role-playing campaign. (an endeavor i, for the most part, agree with.)

 

[ForceUser]

Actually, Monte's review was quite sparse as well. Basically, he says 'the book is good. Buy it'.

Need we say more?

Okay, I'll qualify that - the book is damn good.

 

[Desdichado]

I'm not saying that GURPS books are inaccurate, merely that they're History Lite in most respects. I've occasionally asked about some historical topic around here and been pointed in the direction of GURPS books and find that they're not really incredible sources. I don't buy many of them though, so remembering specific books that disappointed me is tough. I remember reading GURPS Steampunk (or significant portions of it anyway) recently and being quite disappointed that it was really just Victoriana Lite, with very little info on what steampunk would be like, and a lot of generic info that I could pick up very, very easily in another format on Victorian life.

My personal feeling, on the main topic at hand, is that fantasy is fantasy, not medieval life. I rarely try to convey a medieval feel in my campaigns in the first place. I also wonder how difficult that would be to pull off without really entrenching medieval attitudes and viewpoints into the players as well so they can run their characters appropriately for the setting.

Even if I wanted to do that, I think it'd be too much effort for what you get back in return.

 

[Crothian]

JD, then the book is probably not what you are looking for.

 

[Desdichado]

Probably not. But I do understand the content much better now, at least, don't I?

 

[Crothian]

Yes, you do. On of the problems with books like this that people like so much, is that they are really darn useful to some people but worthless to others.

I still say its a good book, and if you ever have a little extra money for a good book that just might sit on the self; then this is the book to buy!!

 

[ForceUser]

Probably not. But I do understand the content much better now, at least, don't I?

*snip*

Adventurers make a profession of taking jobs that others do not want or are unable to do. They do not have a social definition, yet the core rules state that adventurers do not stir any extraordinary attention by virtue of being adventurers. There are a few ways to resolve the magical medieval mindset and the social reaction to adventurers listed in the core rules. The best way of understanding adventurers from this standpoint is calling them mercenaries. They travel and act as sell swords and solve problems for wealthy people. Some also do some pro bono work, saving the occasional village from orcs or rescuing the farmer's daughter from the goblin's lair. Some wreak terrible damage for personal gain, slaying and pillaging as they go. Like mercenaries, PCs are heroes in armed conflict, but worrisome when the conflict ends. They are a dangerous lot by virtue of their mobility, their paucity of social sponsorship, and de facto, the lack of social restraint.

More than likely, then, is that PC adventurers draw at least some attention. First, most PCs usually wear armor and are fully equipped for combat and adventuring. This is not very common in a city, unless it is a time of war or a fort city where most people do soldiering. Even then, having a person in full armor with multiple weapons who is not an aristocrat or a knight is rather rare. Anyone showing up at a city's gates in full armor and fully armed, and who wishes to enter the city in such a state, has a lot of explaining to do. Unless they have a writ or badge identifying their social sponsor, most PCs probably have to surrender martial weaponry and all but light armor into the custody of the city until they depart, at which time, they can collect their things. Second, PCs have backpacks stuffed with interesting things that jingle. As they try to enter the gates, such loot attracts the attention of sellers, pickpockets, and the guards collecting taxes at the gate. On top of paying an entry tax, PCs pay for the goods they bring into the city, even if PCs claim they are not selling anything in town. Bribery, intimidation, bluff, diplomacy, and magic are always options for bypassing the gates and taxes, but PCs must remember that they are subject to the city laws and the force behind them. Third, should someone have the power to look (in larger cities gate guards are always equipped with detect magic) PCs have lots of magic. Cities tax PCs for the magic items they have, and the PCs should obey the civic rules on holding and using magic in the city. Some cities have strong groups that regulate the use and abundance of magic in the city. Some cities require people to surrender certain types of magic items and restrain the use of certain schools of magic in the city. PCs would do well to always get the specifics when entering a new city.

Large trade cities through which many people travel through are more acclimated to adventurers, mercenaries, and the shady lot of society. But for the most part, adventurers stick out in society. Retired adventurers are understandable, seen as wanderers who settled down and entered society at that point. Even if they adventure again, the retired adventurer has roots and social connections that tie him to a locale.

There is an undercurrent among the urban powerful to invite wandering PC adventurers into social obligations, and in effect, a social classification. Adventurers that accept such invitations become agents of a certain lord, religion, or ideal. Such relationships are also beneficial for PCs. Social connections are very useful, if only in tax savings alone. PCs who establish such ties have home bases, relinquishing rented beds and tourist prices for dinner invitations, choice gossip, and surety should something strange happen in their presence.

Another truism of the magical medieval city is that news travels fast, especially bad news, and it seems like everyone knows everyone else's business. When PCs roll into town, it doesn't take long for everyone to hear about them, know what they look like, and learn how many pitchers of ale they had at lunch. This can make subtlety and covert operations difficult for outsiders. People also know that PCs have lots of money, as displayed by the 50 pounds of metal the fighter wears, the goods they carry into the city, and the amount of magic on their person. This affects the prices they pay for goods and services, the number of touts and beggars that follow them around, and thievery attempts. If the PCs look rough and seasoned or if they come with a social connection, it is possible that no one in town wants that much trouble.

And that's why this book rocks. Peace.

 

[BigFreekinGoblinoid]

Thanks everyone, especially Joshua for basically representing the same viewpoint as mine. I can see this sourcebook being VERY useful for an ultra lite magic setting, but the fact that magic changes SOO much if there are only a few competent wizards in a society ( not to mention a few clerics, druids and sorcerors ) a traditional fuedal society would be practically an impossibility (IMO!).

I guess there are really no fast/pat answers for what a truly magical society would be like - there are endless possibilites. In buiding my homebrew, I just can't get past the notion that powerful wizards would be ruling all aspects of an organized society, and was thinking this book might provide some alternate possibilites for me.

--

On Nebadon, the elves never tried to cloister themselves away from the wildy reproductive humans. Instead, they decided to mentor them, and by helping them, teach them some of the Quarlani values. The wise elves knew that they could accomplish their goal of teaching the humans a deep respect for coexisting with the living land by cooperating with men, sharing their knowledge of magic...

The combined aptitude of men and elves forged a great and powerful league of nations, and instead of wasting resources warring with each other, helped each other to build great wonders for the betterment of all:

The great Portals, broad enough to allow passage for even the largest of airships directly to the new continents...

 

[Jürgen Hubert]

OK, if you are looking for a sourcebook on all the ways that magic will alter the fabric of society, this isn't quite for you.

You might want to take a look at Urbis instead, which was created specifically to address these questions.

I can't make the same claim for completeness as MMS:WE, but I do think I came up with some nice ideas. Oh, and it is free - at least for the time being...