Sigil Ciy of Doors (Topology of a Torus) - MATHS

[kenmarable]

I haven't read thing 1 about Sigil in a very long time. When I read the 4E description I also thought it was a fully enclosed city. Makes me wish I could still hunt down the original Planescape material.

There's always the PDFs.

 

[Shemeska]

That's what the picture shows.

The picture shows that the city is the same shape as it has always been. There's an open section there in the picture. It hasn't changed from 2e to 3e to 4e.

The "with no outside" was probably a poor choice of words. But what it presumably meant, which has always been the case, is that there's no exterior edge to the city to climb out onto, or even to see from inside the city over the rim.

 

[MoppyDragon]

Call me an idiot but i am not exactly sure that band around the middle in the picture is an open space. According to the text, you're supposed to be able to walk around the whole city and return to your start point from a straight line, and onyl way to do that would be to walk around the inside of the tube "up" the walls not along the ring, and second, and it's supposed to have "no outside". So I see that would be more like a "window" of some kind or what have you. I just dont tink it can be a hole unless the 4E text is way off base. Hrm, I might email WOTC and ask

[edit] edited a bit

 

[kenmarable]

Call me an idiot but i am not exactly sure that band around the middle in the picture is an open space. According to the text, you're supposed to be able to walk around the whole city and return to your start point from a straight line, and onyl way to do that would be to walk around the inside of the tube "up" the walls not along the ring, and second, and it's supposed to have "no outside". So I see that would be more like a "window" of some kind to let in light, or what have you. In fact it cant possible be a hole unless the text is way off base.

You're not an idiot (especially given how I hear the text explains it), but it has clearly been an open space wen it was first published for 2e 14 years ago and again in the brief mentions of it in 3e, so I would say that it is still open space given the map in 4e.

As for that statement, it sounds like you might just be trying to make too much out of it. It is just saying that you can walk long ways around the inside of the tire and wind up where you started. I think they phrased it poorly if people think that no matter which way you face, you can start walking and without turning wind up where you started. After all, there's sorta buildings and junk cluttering up the place.

 

[Dire Bare]

Call me an idiot but i am not exactly sure that band around the middle in the picture is an open space. According to the text, you're supposed to be able to walk around the whole city and return to your start point from a straight line, and onyl way to do that would be to walk around the inside of the tube "up" the walls not along the ring, and second, and it's supposed to have "no outside". So I see that would be more like a "window" of some kind or what have you. I just dont tink it can be a hole unless the 4E text is way off base. Hrm, I might email WOTC and ask

[edit] edited a bit

You are not an idiot, the description in the 4e Manual of the Planes could be a bit clearer. But the band around the inside of the ring IS open space. It's always been that way, it continues to be that way in 4e. And, if you walk along the "inside bottom" of the torus, you walk in a straight line and eventually end up where you started.

Personally, sometimes I think an enclosed tube would be a bit neater of a concept than one with the inside of the ring open to space. Then there would truly be no "outside" of the city. But that is not the way Sigil has been designed.

 

[Xris Robin]

There is no hole. The 'Illumination' section even flat out says that at night you can look up and see the city on the far side.

You could explain that by saying it's a ringworld type thing, but that isn't what's displayed on the picture. The picture clearly shows city built on the so-called 'open' area.

 

[avin]

I see no buildings there, it's an empty space as always have been...

...except for all City of Brass upgrades (oldest city, biggest commerce hub), I see no nerf on Sigil's format.

"The city is built on the inside of a gigantic, hollow ring", not a tube.

 

[Xris Robin]

Look at the picture again. Look at the part right above the 'Sigil' label, between The Clerk's Ward and The Hive. It clearly shows how the city wraps around the inside of the tube.

I seriously don't understand how someone can look at this picture and see a ringworld. It's clearly a torus.

 

[malraux]

Look at the picture again. Look at the part right above the 'Sigil' label, between The Clerk's Ward and The Hive. It clearly shows how the city wraps around the inside of the tube.

I seriously don't understand how someone can look at this picture and see a ringworld. It's clearly a torus.

The cutaway section clearly shows a circle that only goes through ~330 degrees of arc.

 

[Dragonbait]

Look at the picture again. Look at the part right above the 'Sigil' label, between The Clerk's Ward and The Hive. It clearly shows how the city wraps around the inside of the tube.

I seriously don't understand how someone can look at this picture and see a ringworld. It's clearly a torus.

It is supposed to be a ring world:http://www.shadowland.org/Planescape/images/sigilring.jpg

In several sources it described the fact that you could fly straight up from one side and land on the other. And at night (or antipeak) you can see a strip of lights like stars in the sky. That's the street lamps, store windows and so on from the other end of the ring. Also, if it's an enclosed torus, you could not walk off the side and disappear into the nothingness.

It is said that the Lady controls the actual width of the city, making it larger or more narrow to suit the city's needs. Its usually displayed with a larger opening , so maybe the city was rather packed at the time of the rendering of the image? ;p