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<blockquote data-quote="Captain Panda" data-source="post: 8497342" data-attributes="member: 6861845">But many of the features being compared here inflict disadvantage (or in some other way functionally make it less likely a creature will make save) at cheaper cost. Heightened Spell keeps coming up, but it gives disadvantage on a save at no action cost and at a similar cost. It does that, and it's a metamagic almost no one takes because disadvantage (or a reroll) on one saving throw isn't really that great an effect. You need to have a potent single target effect in the first place to make this option workable, and then you have to use a second resource on top of the first one to hopefully neutralize a single target.Unsettling Words, Hound of Ill Omen, Mind Sliver, Heightened Spell, Magical Ambush... there are a lot of features that do this sort of thing already for cheaper either in action cost, resource expenditure, or both without blowing anything up. One thing that I don't think has been brought up that bears mentioning... single target save spells aren't that great, generally, so doubling down on their usage in action and resource cost is not a great strategy. It's not terrible, and it'll feel good when it lands. But it will also feel bad when you flush a bunch of actions and spell slots trying to get something to fail a save only to have it succeed, or use a legendary resistance. I should also disclose my bias in that regard: I think trying to burn through legendary resistances is usually a pretty bad idea. I've been playing 5e since it came out, and I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen legendary resistance run out soon enough to be relevant. Once it's at 20% health, even if it's out of legendaries, just hit it a few more times.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Captain Panda, post: 8497342, member: 6861845"] But many of the features being compared here inflict disadvantage (or in some other way functionally make it less likely a creature will make save) at cheaper cost. Heightened Spell keeps coming up, but it gives disadvantage on a save at no action cost and at a similar cost. It does that, and it's a metamagic almost no one takes because disadvantage (or a reroll) on one saving throw isn't really that great an effect. You need to have a potent single target effect in the first place to make this option workable, and then you have to use a second resource on top of the first one to hopefully neutralize a single target. Unsettling Words, Hound of Ill Omen, Mind Sliver, Heightened Spell, Magical Ambush... there are a lot of features that do this sort of thing already for cheaper either in action cost, resource expenditure, or both without blowing anything up. One thing that I don't think has been brought up that bears mentioning... single target save spells aren't that great, generally, so doubling down on their usage in action and resource cost is not a great strategy. It's not terrible, and it'll feel good when it lands. But it will also feel bad when you flush a bunch of actions and spell slots trying to get something to fail a save only to have it succeed, or use a legendary resistance. I should also disclose my bias in that regard: I think trying to burn through legendary resistances is usually a pretty bad idea. I've been playing 5e since it came out, and I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen legendary resistance run out soon enough to be relevant. Once it's at 20% health, even if it's out of legendaries, just hit it a few more times. [/QUOTE]

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