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<blockquote data-quote="Starfox" data-source="post: 6182718" data-attributes="member: 2303">Ladies and gentlemen, I don't think discussing the merits of 4E's skill challenges are going to lead anywhere. We have exhausted that topic. If this discussion is to lead anywhere, we should rather discuss the goals for eventual 5E skill challenges, and methods to get there. Other games can be interesting as inspiration and as comparison. Sorry to contradict myself a few pages back when I said discussing 4E skill challenges is interesting. To a point it is, but past that point it just becomes edition waring.A game that might be worth looking up for inspiration on skill challenges is Mouse Guard. A very structured game. They have a universal resolution system that are used for all more dramatic scenes that is quite similar to a skill challenge, but which does include conditional successes and consequences besides winning and losing. And which also interestingly enough has a reward mechanism that rewards failure quite a lot - each roll gives xp, there are &quot;fail xp&quot; and &quot;success xp&quot; and you need both to advance. Failing the initial roll in a skill challenge grants a fail xp, and also forces more rolls, each of which gives more xp.This system is a bit too complex to reference here, but if anyone has read it it is quite interesting as an exercise in formal game structure. Not sure it is good - only played a single session of it and have some reservations - but certainly interesting.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Starfox, post: 6182718, member: 2303"] Ladies and gentlemen, I don't think discussing the merits of 4E's skill challenges are going to lead anywhere. We have exhausted that topic. If this discussion is to lead anywhere, we should rather discuss the goals for eventual 5E skill challenges, and methods to get there. Other games can be interesting as inspiration and as comparison. Sorry to contradict myself a few pages back when I said discussing 4E skill challenges is interesting. To a point it is, but past that point it just becomes edition waring. A game that might be worth looking up for inspiration on skill challenges is Mouse Guard. A very structured game. They have a universal resolution system that are used for all more dramatic scenes that is quite similar to a skill challenge, but which does include conditional successes and consequences besides winning and losing. And which also interestingly enough has a reward mechanism that rewards failure quite a lot - each roll gives xp, there are "fail xp" and "success xp" and you need both to advance. Failing the initial roll in a skill challenge grants a fail xp, and also forces more rolls, each of which gives more xp. This system is a bit too complex to reference here, but if anyone has read it it is quite interesting as an exercise in formal game structure. Not sure it is good - only played a single session of it and have some reservations - but certainly interesting. [/QUOTE]

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