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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Libramarian" data-source="post: 6120443" data-attributes="member: 6688858">I think  @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582" target="_blank">pemerton</a>  (correct me if I'm wrong) DOES want to set up "gotcha"  moments for a Paladin PC, in order to provoke character change and  development. But he wants the player to be able to determine the path  their Paladin takes through it and what it means, so he doesn't want a  mechanic where the game and/or GM immediately determines the morality of  the Paladin's action.*I think pemerton would like the type of the mechanic  @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=6696971" target="_blank">Manbearcat</a>  suggested to me earlier in the thread, where the paladin oaths are all  bimodal--you get a bennie whether you stick to your oath or renege on  it, because it can lead to an interesting story development either way.  My concern with that as the core Paladin mechanic (besides the fact that  it would replace a game mechanic that I like) is that I would feel  obligated to set up the Paladin player in these situations, when I ordinarily don't do much very much scene-framing  at all. Someone earlier in the thread said that their Paladin player was  upset because they expected more spotlight and attention--this could  definitely happen in my game. I don't want to have to make the campaign  about Paladinhood just because a player chose a Paladin. It's an interesting idea for a  modular option that requires player-DM coordination before switching it  on, though.I think the Paladin class could be written to accomodate both the gamist  oath-as-challenge Paladin and the narrativist oath-as-premise Paladin  with two modules. That would be a really interesting. However I  don't see that happening. I foresee a compromise being made where there  is no mechanical incentive to throw the Paladin into conflict, and no  serious mechanical consequences for failing to follow their  restrictions. The Paladin is perfectly balanced and becomes  indistinguishable from a Fighter/Cleric. This is the process where  D&D loses it flavor and gets blander and blander.*So a gotcha for the character, not for the player.</blockquote>

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