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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tovec" data-source="post: 6123094" data-attributes="member: 95493">There seems to be some confusion. To be clearer, my problem between Side A and Side B was only how they were interpreting, not what the terms of it were.I personally DO have a problem with how paladins fall and what powers they lose. I always have. In my previous post that is not at all what I was discussing however and as such it has nothing to do with the 'proficiency' posts that have come after. At the moment all I am doing is seeking a solution for the future of the game, not the past.Now, it seems that one side likes the restrictions of the class, in whatever form they end up being. To that end they see it as essential that those restrictions be the default set up and that if people dislike that option they should ignore it. I am mostly in this camp. I say this without knowing ANY details of how they fall, or what they lose.The other side seems to dislike any form of restriction (by way of falling); not limited to but including what they lose and under which conditions they lose it. I also agree that this is a problem and something we should look into, as losing everything for a simple slip is not a healthy idea IMHO. I however do not agree, as this camp seems to think, that any set of restrictions here could reasonably be added onto the class after the fact.In this case as with alignments, I think, it is MUCH harder to add the restriction for roleplaying in than it is to remove that restriction. In one case you have to convince a group of people that the paladin falling and losing their class abilities is a good idea (when I don't really think it is) and getting them to agree (authority to enforce the rule). The other option being that if the rule is the default one that the group can merely decide they are NOT doing that (paladins falling) and then go from there. I see this second option as much more easily accomplished as it does not impose a restriction into an otherwise un-imposed arena.Again, that has NOTHING to do with the restriction itself, or the details of how they fall, or how a fall is dissimilar or similar to proficiencies or class goals (..and I don't know how we got onto a rogue's armor but whatever..) For those comments, I think you need to refer to my older posts. I leave you all to discuss that aspect, as I'm sure you will to no end. I don't really care right now about that aspect since none of you are writing the rule and it also seems that (for now) they need to work on what WILL be in the paladin class, not what the paladin class is without those abilities.</blockquote>

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