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<blockquote data-quote="Stalker0" data-source="post: 4800643" data-attributes="member: 5889">Well since the MM2 just came out, it might be helpful to look at the new mechanics for solos that have helped with this.1) Saves at the beginning of the turn and end. The Copper Dragon for example can make saves against immobilized, restrained, and the like at the beginning and end of his turn. The PH2 errated saving throws so that if you make multiple ones in the same round it doesn't accelerate harmful effects (aka the weirdness of hobgoblins being potential more vulnerable to sleep).2) Multiple turns in one round. This is a new mechanic that basically allows a creature multiple chances to shake off effects simply by having more than one turn per round. However, you can accelerate conditions (like sleep) with all the saving throws.Both of this effects do not help with &quot;until the end of your turn&quot; effects many PCs have, which I was surprised about. To me those are quite common effects, and it seems strange that at higher levels they can become stronger than save ends effects.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Stalker0, post: 4800643, member: 5889"] Well since the MM2 just came out, it might be helpful to look at the new mechanics for solos that have helped with this. 1) Saves at the beginning of the turn and end. The Copper Dragon for example can make saves against immobilized, restrained, and the like at the beginning and end of his turn. The PH2 errated saving throws so that if you make multiple ones in the same round it doesn't accelerate harmful effects (aka the weirdness of hobgoblins being potential more vulnerable to sleep). 2) Multiple turns in one round. This is a new mechanic that basically allows a creature multiple chances to shake off effects simply by having more than one turn per round. However, you can accelerate conditions (like sleep) with all the saving throws. Both of this effects do not help with "until the end of your turn" effects many PCs have, which I was surprised about. To me those are quite common effects, and it seems strange that at higher levels they can become stronger than save ends effects. [/QUOTE]

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