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<blockquote data-quote="CydKnight" data-source="post: 7035564" data-attributes="member: 6873462">If it were me, I would have had the Fighter (PC) roll a perception check against the Redbrands Stealth roll after he opened the door and before he stepped into the room.&nbsp; If the Fighter's roll is lower, then the Redbrands can take a surprise attack after his first step into the room.To me, there is no opportunity for a &quot;Ready&quot; action yet because combat has not begun at the point you described one.&nbsp; For listening at the door, I'm not sure what that would accomplish since you already explained the party knew the Redbrands were there because they had previously seen them in this room while disguised.&nbsp; I suppose you could do a perception check to determine their general location in the room but that doesn't tell you whether their intent is to hide or whether they are hiding with intent to surprise attack.&nbsp; As far as the PCs know, the Redbrands in this room still believe they are Redbrands too.&nbsp; This would require an Insight check in my opinion (and probably a difficult one) because you are trying to determine intent based on perceived location in the room which you cannot see from the PCs position until it is too late.So if the player's are not telling you their intent before entering the room, and being very specific about their actions about how they plan to enter the room to avoid a surprise attack, then avoiding it will be difficult at best.&nbsp; Just because you think there might be a trap doesn't always mean you will avoid it and sometimes it's not about what the player thinks he knows, it's what the PC actually does know and those kinds of things should always be left up to a dice roll in my opinion.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="CydKnight, post: 7035564, member: 6873462"] If it were me, I would have had the Fighter (PC) roll a perception check against the Redbrands Stealth roll after he opened the door and before he stepped into the room. If the Fighter's roll is lower, then the Redbrands can take a surprise attack after his first step into the room. To me, there is no opportunity for a "Ready" action yet because combat has not begun at the point you described one. For listening at the door, I'm not sure what that would accomplish since you already explained the party knew the Redbrands were there because they had previously seen them in this room while disguised. I suppose you could do a perception check to determine their general location in the room but that doesn't tell you whether their intent is to hide or whether they are hiding with intent to surprise attack. As far as the PCs know, the Redbrands in this room still believe they are Redbrands too. This would require an Insight check in my opinion (and probably a difficult one) because you are trying to determine intent based on perceived location in the room which you cannot see from the PCs position until it is too late. So if the player's are not telling you their intent before entering the room, and being very specific about their actions about how they plan to enter the room to avoid a surprise attack, then avoiding it will be difficult at best. Just because you think there might be a trap doesn't always mean you will avoid it and sometimes it's not about what the player thinks he knows, it's what the PC actually does know and those kinds of things should always be left up to a dice roll in my opinion. [/QUOTE]

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