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<blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 7039811" data-attributes="member: 16814">Well, no, because at anything more than 80', the assassin is at disadvantage for range.&nbsp; Cancels the advantage, so no sneak attack.If the party lets this happen more than twice, they deserve it.But, all that said, I meant allowing the surprise attack to be narrated before determining initiative for the following round, not 'attack without initiative, then surprise round initiative, then normal.'&nbsp; Clearly, that's bad.&nbsp; But 'has surprise, no one in party is aware, narrate surprise round attack, roll initiative as normal for following rounds' doesn't dramatically overpower the assassin sub-class at all.Personally, I rule the assassinate ability to be viable in the first entire round of combat.&nbsp; So, if the assassin surprised the target(s), they get to do an auto-crit whenever they go in initiative for the first (surprise) round.&nbsp; They did the work to set up the ambush and they still have to hit, I see no reason why they also need to win initiative.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ovinomancer, post: 7039811, member: 16814"] Well, no, because at anything more than 80', the assassin is at disadvantage for range. Cancels the advantage, so no sneak attack. If the party lets this happen more than twice, they deserve it. But, all that said, I meant allowing the surprise attack to be narrated before determining initiative for the following round, not 'attack without initiative, then surprise round initiative, then normal.' Clearly, that's bad. But 'has surprise, no one in party is aware, narrate surprise round attack, roll initiative as normal for following rounds' doesn't dramatically overpower the assassin sub-class at all. Personally, I rule the assassinate ability to be viable in the first entire round of combat. So, if the assassin surprised the target(s), they get to do an auto-crit whenever they go in initiative for the first (surprise) round. They did the work to set up the ambush and they still have to hit, I see no reason why they also need to win initiative. [/QUOTE]

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