Source/Role Matrix in the Advanced Player's Guide

[CrimsonHawk]

I queried Joseph Browning of Expeditious Retreat about the sources and roles of the new classes being introduced in the Advanced Player's Guide. [link] This is what I found out:

Martial Artist (Divine Striker)
Nature Priest (Divine Controller)
Savage Warrior (Martial Defender)
Spellbinder (Arcane Controller)
Troubadour (Arcane Leader)

I got this because the martial artist and the nature priest are the two classes Mr. Browning did not correct me on... and he said I'd gotten two out of the five correct. (Technically, I got the Troubadour correct, as well, but he listed it as if he were correcting me on it, so I'm assuming he thought I got it wrong.)

As a bit of trivia, if you include the swordmage from the FRPG, the artificer playtest from Dragon Magazine, and FF6Shadow's Lancer class [link], not only are all the "holes" in the source/role matrix filled (with three sources and four roles), but also each role has four classes each. The sources are not quite so balanced.

-----
Dale W. Robbins

 

[GMforPowergamers]

I was hopeing Martial Artist would be Martial...Arie has disapointed me...but he is still a fav auther and designer and I still have the book pre ordered

 

[Mouseferatu]

I was hopeing Martial Artist would be Martial...Arie has disapointed me...but he is still a fav auther and designer and I still have the book pre ordered

If it makes you feel any better, I dithered for a good long while between martial and divine for the monk. But I wound up going with divine for several reasons:

1) The older edition monks used ki, which has a strong spiritual component. That felt more divine than martial.

2) Monks have a lot of powers that felt a little more supernatural in nature than the martial power source would have justified.

3) There's already two martial strikers in the core rules, whereas there are no divine strikers anywhere in the game yet. (That alone wouldn't have made the decision for me, but as a tertiary reason, it helped tip the scales.)

Sorry you're disappointed its not martial, but I think you'll be happy with the class in general. (And it's not a hard flavor change to make, if you want to.)

 

[RabidBob]

Sorry, this is off the topic a bit, but could someone post the link to the pre-order page for the Advanced Player's Guide? I've managed to lose it.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Sorry, this is off the topic a bit, but could someone post the link to the pre-order page for the Advanced Player's Guide? I've managed to lose it.

I think that could possibly be arranged.

4th Edition D&D

 

[Fallen Seraph]

It is obvious Ari that the Martial Artist is focused towards the Monk. But how hard would you say it would be to reflavour as a Brawler/Dirty Fighting type (one class idea I have found never been fully realized)?

 

[Mouseferatu]

It is obvious Ari that the Martial Artist is focused towards the Monk. But how hard would you say it would be to reflavour as a Brawler/Dirty Fighting type (one class idea I have found never been fully realized)?

Shouldn't be hard. You'll want to change most if not all of the flavor descriptions, but I'd say over 75% of the mechanics could be made to work without alteration, and the rest could work for that concept with only a modicum of alteration. Maybe trade out a few of the more obviously supernatural ones for a couple fighter or savage warrior exploits.

 

[Fallen Seraph]

Shouldn't be hard. You'll want to change most if not all of the flavor descriptions, but I'd say over 75% of the mechanics could be made to work without alteration, and the rest could work for that concept with only a modicum of alteration. Maybe trade out a few of the more obviously supernatural ones for a couple fighter or savage warrior exploits.

Cool, thanks, exactly what I wanted to hear. w00t future eye-gouging, knee snapping brawler is on its way

 

[CrimsonHawk]

3) There's already two martial strikers in the core rules, whereas there are no divine strikers anywhere in the game yet. (That alone wouldn't have made the decision for me, but as a tertiary reason, it helped tip the scales.)

I, for one, appreciate your decision, Mr. Marmell. When the PHB was first published, I was irked that there were two Martial Strikers, yet no Divine Strikers, three strikers total, yet only one controller. I guess I'm mildly OCD or something, but those facts irked me.

Your decision, whether it was intended to do so or not, helped bring a bit more balance to the matrix. Now we just have to work on the fact that there are six Martial classes, six Arcane classes, yet only four Divine classes. (This assumes the inclusion of the Artificer, Swordmage, and Lancer, as I mentioned above.)

 

[Wonka]

I apologize if you have mentioned this elsewhere, but is the reason you choose to ignore the obvious power source for the "martial artist" as ki is because WoTC hasn't released that power source officially yet?