spell damage 1d8/level question

[kreynolds]

Plus, what good are FR maps to a non-FR DM?

Oh, for god's sake, man! FR maps aren't[/n] any good to a non-FR DM! But generally, when you purchase and use the FRCS, thereby making you an FR-DM, the maps are pretty frickin' good! So tell me, why the hell would I suggest to you that the FR maps are pretty nice if I wasn't talking about FR? Argh!

Do I have to spell everything out?

 

[James McMurray]

Well, considering I had mentioned not using the FRCS, it was probably a fairly safe assumption that I wasn't running an FR campaign. Thus, your mention of the use for FR maps was a bit confusing to me.

Not to mention, why on earth would I want to run an FR campaign when we all know FR is over-powered, broken, and got the shaft?

 

[James McMurray]

Also, given your general tone, you may want to change your sig to read "IMNSHO" instead.

 

[kreynolds]

1d8 electricity damage per level
target one creature only
ranged touch attack
close range
fortitude save for 1/2 damage

what level would that be, and why?

With a damage cap of 10d8, I'd put it at 4th. With no damage cap, I'd put it at 8th or 9th, but probably just 8th.

The damage is worse than a Fireball cast at 10th level (10d6), though isn't a burst effect, so that balances out the touch attack and fort save bit, as well as the damage. The fact that it's electrical doesn't really have any bearing on my opinion. As for the range, it would depend. With the damage cap of 10d8 and being a 4th level spell, I'd give you medium range, not short. Without a damage cap and being an 8th level spell, I'd only give you short range.

Neat spell.

 

[kreynolds]

Well, considering I had mentioned not using the FRCS, it was probably a fairly safe assumption that I wasn't running an FR campaign. Thus, your mention of the use for FR maps was a bit confusing to me.

That's neither here nor there. I knew that you weren't using the FRCS. My entire post to you was a suggestion that you should purchase it for the materials contained within, a sales pitch if you will. You took it out of context.

Not to mention, why on earth would I want to run an FR campaign when we all know FR is over-powered, broken, and got the shaft?

LOL

I can tell you why I run in FR, no matter how over-powered or broken it may be. I'm just that damned good.

 

[Jens]

With a damage cap of 10d8, I'd put it at 4th. With no damage cap, I'd put it at 8th or 9th, but probably just 8th.

Looking at DMG table 3-22, I'd put it at 3rd, I can hardly see how it can be put any higher???

The damage is worse than a Fireball cast at 10th level (10d6), though isn't a burst effect, so that balances out the touch attack and fort save bit, as well as the damage.

Counting possible criticals and sneak attacks, I don't think ranged attack requirements should be counted as much of a weakness. In some cases it's a benefit: You can (try to) target someone you can't see etc.

The fact that it's electrical doesn't really have any bearing on my opinion.

Agreed. With Energy Substitution as a feat, it should hardly be a factor at all.

As for the range, it would depend. With the damage cap of 10d8 and being a 4th level spell, I'd give you medium range, not short.

At 4th level... I'd give you long range and still think it was a weak spell.

Without a damage cap and being an 8th level spell, I'd only give you short range.

Counting 20 dice as an effective maximum, 6th level would be fine by the book. Truly openended would require an infinete-level slot if you expand from the table. (That table is great!)

Neat spell.

What do you think of Acid Bolt, BTW? I think that's about as good as an instant-effect-ranged-individual-elementa- damage-attack-spell can be at 2nd level.

Edit: kreynolds, only a good post is worth commenting like that

 

[Shard O'Glase]

If it capped at 10d8 I'd place it at 3rd level. Hers is my general rule for spells that do damage. If the spell does the cap limit and noting else the lower level cap limit(2nd for the 10d6 single target category). If the spell does something else(secondary effects stuned round, chains, or does a bit more damage like d8) then I put it in the higer of the two levels it could be or 3rd for an arcane 10d single target spell.

Basically ignore kyeynolds on this, he wants this spell at 4th and if you weaken blade barrier at all one of the most overpowered spells in the game then it should be a lower level. He obviously has something against wizards casting spells for damage, and wants the clerics to be the big spell firepower damage dealers.

edited for drunken typing

 

[Xarlen]

I would say with the 10d8 cap it'd be 4th level. 20d8 cap... Well, it can't rival Blade Barrier, but I'd say 6th.

 

[kreynolds]

Looking at DMG table 3-22, I'd put it at 3rd, I can hardly see how it can be put any higher???Counting possible criticals and sneak attacks, I don't think ranged attack requirements should be counted as much of a weakness. In some cases it's a benefit: You can (try to) target someone you can't see etc.

Fireball, a 3rd level spell, caps out at 10d6 points of damage, for a total of 60 points of damage. This spell, if indeed capped, would cap out a 80 points of damage. You really need to keep in mind that the standard damage die used to benchmark a spell is a d6, as that is the most popular die when concerning direct damage dealing spells, such as Fireball, Delayed Blast Fireball (errated to d6), Acid Orb, Lightning Bolt, Chain Lightning, etc. Taking that into consideration, a 4th level spell has a maximum damage die limit of 15 die (d6 for benchmark purposes) for a single target (maximum 90 points of damage), but this spell has too many advantages for me to give it max damage or a lower level.

Also, a fireball is a 20-foot radius burst, which has the potential to affect multiple targets, and that's also the drawback to the spell because you have to be careful how you place it. This spell, however, uses a ranged touch attack, and no matter how you cut it, it's easy as hell to hit 80% - 90% of your targets with a ranged touch attack, not to mention the fact that a Fortitude save is worse than a Reflex, especially for those classes that have Evasion, or for anyone that has a Ring of Evasion, as it won't help them. So, that is quite obviously a benefit of the spell, and I never said it wasn't.

So, we have higher damage die (d8 instead of the popular d6), an easier and safer delivery method, and a tougher save. Not a 3rd level spell in my book.

At 4th level... I'd give you long range and still think it was a weak spell.

Yeah. After going over it again, I guess a range of Long wouldn't be so bad.

Counting 20 dice as an effective maximum, 6th level would be fine by the book.

Don't forget about the advantages of this spell. I mentioned them above. 6th level would be fine by me, but only if the spell required a ranged attack, not a ranged touch attack, and if the damage die were smaller, such as d6.

What do you think of Acid Bolt, BTW? I think that's about as good as an instant-effect-ranged-individual-elementa- damage-attack-spell can be at 2nd level.

Let me take a look at it. I'll keep pondering on the spell in question too.

 

[kreynolds]

I would say with the 10d8 cap it'd be 4th level. 20d8 cap... Well, it can't rival Blade Barrier, but I'd say 6th.

The more I look at it, the more I lean that direction as well.